Klytus, I'm bored.

[Starbeard]

After reading this thread on Dragonsfoot about EGG calling out every 10' in the maps:

I'm trying to build my chops at describing dungeons to players as they map. Straight corridors and rectangular rooms are all okay, but diagonal and curved corridors can be tricky.

How did the original groups describe angles and curves bitd? Say while walking along a 10' wide corridor you came across another corridor branching off to the left 45°, and take it. Would the 10s of feet be counted off for each square it crosses diagonally? Would they be ballparked and the mapper has have to estimate how long it really is? What about corridors that bend or loop? Was it any more specific than, "The passage begins to turn to the right in a wide/tight bend"?

[Deleted]

Ten feet, twenty feet, you've turned about one point north, thiry feet, forty feet, you're about two points north now.

Getting an exact map was never the object.

[MormonYoYoMan]

(First RPG I ever played; no rules in sight.)

DM: "You go 10 feet, turn; 20 feet, you're lost."

[Starbeard]

Thanks for that! Egads, I don't know why I never considered just using compass points. That seems so obvious now.

[howandwhy99]

I remember hearing about groups where the DM required the players to measure to gain certain specifics. This would be for standard campaign play, not a convention one-shots. I think it allows for the players to learn new techniques as they improved at the game.

For example, beginning descriptions: "Leaving the room you walk down the corridor a little ways and the corridor splits left and right up ahead."

Different measuring would allow for different descriptions. Measuring their pace could mean counting paces through the dungeon and quickly learning distances. "Leaving the room the corridor continues unbroken for 10, 20, 30, 40, 50, 60 feet before splitting left and right up ahead."

Actions like this would slow down mappers as they found different means to measure distances, angles, rises, curves, and all the other tricks of the map.

Does any of that sound familiar?

[robertsconley]

May 24, 2017 1:45:15 GMT -6 @gronanofsimmerya said:

Ten feet, twenty feet, you've turned about one point north, thiry feet, forty feet, you're about two points north now.

Getting an exact map was never the object.

How do you know which way is north It is basically fantasy medieval we are talking about here in regards to having a lodestone or compass.

Normally I use miniatures but when I do verbal only, I use relative directions.

Ten feet, twenty feet, you've turned about one point to the left, thirty feet, forty feet, you're about two more points to the left.

When I play, I use lines in a stick to map rather than trying to figure it out with graph paper. The only time I took the time to do a full map if we are certain there something was missed and trying to figure places to look for secret door. Even then if the dungeon layout was a bunch of long corridors with rooms of them we wound't both and just take the time to search. Hoping like hell a wandering monster wouldn't appear.

[talysman]

May 25, 2017 11:10:54 GMT -6 robertsconley said:

May 24, 2017 1:45:15 GMT -6 @gronanofsimmerya said:

Ten feet, twenty feet, you've turned about one point north, thiry feet, forty feet, you're about two points north now.

Getting an exact map was never the object.

How do you know which way is north It is basically fantasy medieval we are talking about here in regards to having a lodestone or compass.

Or a dwarf. C'mon, I know you know about dwarves...

May 25, 2017 11:10:54 GMT -6 robertsconley said:

Normally I use miniatures but when I do verbal only, I use relative directions.

Ten feet, twenty feet, you've turned about one point to the left, thirty feet, forty feet, you're about two more points to the left.

If there is no dwarf in the party, I'd probably go with something like this. Or have players pick a direction as their arbitrary "north" (top of the page) and describe from there. That seems easier.

[Deleted]

North,south, east, and west are easier for the referee. You don't have to adjust them based on the group's direction of travel.

[foxroe]

Except of course when the players blunder into a teleportation trap that dumps them in an identical area, but it's oriented differently (a la B1).

[Cedgewick]

Dave mentions in FFC:

At the height of my participation as chief co-ordinator there were six Dungeons and over 100 detailed player characters to be kept track of at any one time.

Who was running the other dungeons besides Greg?

[Deleted]

Don't know. Before my time.

[MormonYoYoMan]

Jun 4, 2017 21:51:54 GMT -6 @gronanofsimmerya said:

Don't know. Before my time.

This is a good answer for almost any question. I think I'll steal it and use it forever.

[foxroe]

Jun 5, 2017 6:14:39 GMT -6 MormonYoYoMan said:

This is a good answer for almost any question. I think I'll steal it and use it forever.

Just avoid saying it was after your time...

[flightcommander]

Also written as DK;BMT.

[MormonYoYoMan]

Neé "Dark Knight; BatMan Time."

[Cedgewick]

Who currently owns "The Mornard Fragments"?

Do you know how one could view the full 24 pages?

[Deleted]

1) Jon Peterson
2) Ask him?

[Scott Anderson]

Can you use a spear as a 10' pole?

What's the difference between a spear and a pike? Is it only length?

Did you ever have pike-and-shield guys? Or are pikes only two-handed?

What about military forks or some of the other stabby pole arms? How do they fit in?

[Deleted]

1) Yes, often
2) Length. One handed spear is 6 to 9 feet, two handed spear is 10 to 12, pikes are 18 to 20 feet.
3) Two handed.
4) Polearms appear in the equipment list. I'm not sure what you mean?

[Scott Anderson]

Based on your answer, I think stabby pole arms fit into the same slot as two-handed spears. Thank you!

[Scott Anderson]

Do you use shield facing? Like, will shield AC count versus rear attacks?

[Deleted]

Absolutely. Facing is vital. Shield only counts from front or left side.

[sixdemonbag]

Jul 7, 2017 11:29:16 GMT -6 @gronanofsimmerya said:

Absolutely. Facing is vital. Shield only counts from front or left side.

This reminds me, as a ref, I need to utilize "monsters" with shields more often. I tend to forget or just never even consider it. This would include man-types and goblins, etc.

[murquhart72]

I had several questions that I know have come up often, but was wondering Gronan's take on things, having been there and all:

1) Elves: know any that played 'em? If so, how did one divvy up hit dice between two classes or otherwise run them before the Greyhawk supplement came about? Regarding armor, I see many consider elves can only use magic armor, which makes no sense to me as that would indicate the Clerics can only use weapons and armor if they're magical also. I'm assuming that "magic" armor also includes the more mundane stuff too.

2) Hid Dice in general: Where they rolled once at creation then added to per level? Rolled at every level in total (like the Superhero example)? Perhaps even rolled fresh before every combat?

3) Reading about mermen and their attacks, one gets the sense these aren't your half-man/half-fish types, but rather bipedal fish-men (Deep Ones?). Do you remember them being described as such at all? How exactly does a dude with a tail instead of legs "mount" a seahorse; side-saddle?

4) Was there a limit on how many PCs a player could control? For example, did anyone ever roll up 2+ characters to use at once, or did they have to wait 'til they could afford retainers/mercenaries?

5) Are all magic swords supposed to have alignment, intelligence and ego? Is there a random way to tell which do and which are "just magic swords"?

6) Rounds and turns. Are these messed up a little? I'm looking at troll regeneration and ooze damage and it seems... slow.2

7) Would the Referee roll all the dice or did players usually roll their own hits, damage, saves, etc.?

[foxroe]

@gronanofsimmerya , you made a statement in another thread:

Aug 22, 2017 16:22:20 GMT -6 @gronanofsimmerya said:

The WORST thing that ever happened to this game... EVEN WORSE THAN MODULES... is the switch in player mentality from "We are part of a team" to "ME ME ME ME ME ME ME!"

While I don't disagree that something is lost when team-based play breaks down, I was curious about why you consider "modules" to be a blight on the game.

[Deleted]

Because I agree with Rob Kuntz that it turned the game from one of imagination to one of consumption.

[foxroe]

Ah, I see. I agree with that to some extent. However, I do see modules as being a useful resource/springboard for the beginning referee, especially the early "B" modules and perhaps even The Village of Hommlet. But that certainly doesn't mean that one needs to buy and use them all.

[sixdemonbag]

I agree with both @gronanofsimmerya and foxroe . Modules can be invaluable examples for teaching a new DM, who has never played before (like myself once-upon-a-time), how to actually run and design things. Once learned, the DM can create their own worlds.

And fortunately for the industry's business, new suckers....er DMs are born everyday! 

[Porphyre]

Aug 23, 2017 22:53:23 GMT -6 sixdemonbag said:

And fortunately for the industry's business, new suckers....er DMs are born everyday! 

I wish I could share your optimism about the future of the hobby ... 

[sixdemonbag]

Aug 24, 2017 7:53:38 GMT -6 Porphyre said:

Aug 23, 2017 22:53:23 GMT -6 sixdemonbag said:

And fortunately for the industry's business, new suckers....er DMs are born everyday! 

I wish I could share your optimism about the future of the hobby ... 

Are you referring to the hobby's survival or style of play? NOTE: I only ask because current interest in D&D seems to be the highest it's been outside of the 80's.