CARCOSA available in 1st and Expurgated Editions

[coffee]

Here's my take on the other 98%:


I love the robot generator. Inspired wackiness.

I didn't like the random dice thing. Hit dice and hit points are way too variable in this scheme; I feel it doesn't give the players enough information to judge situations.

Ordinarily, if the three remaining party members have six hit points among them, and a dragon shows up, they're toast. Period. (As always, barring some really really clever roleplaying...)

But in the world of Carcosa, this doesn't necessarily happen. I see this causing frustration among the players (as well as confusion on the part of the referee, at least if I were to try to run this!) But I thought that back when it was proposed on another thread hereabouts, too. And it's just my opinion; others might like it.

I like the map and may use it myself. I won't be using either the specific descriptions of the hexes as they are; but I won't be using the specific world of Carcosa as is either. Just not my cup of tea. Nothing against those who like it (or, for that matter, those who hate it, or are indifferent to it), but it just doesn't do it for me.

Then again, I was never that much into Lovecraft, either.

I'm still not sure how I feel about the Psionics. At least it's better than the system in Eldritch Wizardry!

[greyharp]

I've always been a pure fantasist, but Carcosa has made me think about the unthinkable (for me), mixing sci-fi with fantasy and more, adding pure horror to the mix. This is a big change for me, modules like S3 were always a big turn-off. I only recently read my first Mars book by Burroughs, not to mention Thongor.

Carcosa is a rich, complex and incredibly dangerous place. I saw one criticism elsewhere that it failed to give hope by lacking detail about "human" society amidst all the overwhelming horror. For me this was one of the product's strengths, since it enables me as a DM to easily make it my own, by deciding for myself what direction human history and society will take.

I'll have to re-read the section on the ever-changing dice mechanic to truly get my head around it, but it's certainly an intriguing idea that I look forward to trying.

For me Carcosa is an intricate, fascinating unfinished painting, one that demands my attention and then screams at me to pick up my brush and finish it.

[blackbarn]

Oct 22, 2008 12:52:12 GMT -6 coffee said:

I didn't like the random dice thing. Hit dice and hit points are way too variable in this scheme; I feel it doesn't give the players enough information to judge situations.

That's a good point to bring up. I had actually forgotten that was even in there since it seemed too unreliable for it's own good and I didn't plan to use it. Geoffrey, what do your players think of this system? Are they ever frustrated or is the randomness fun for them?

As for the supplement not going into the human society or giving any hope, since it is a supplement one could assume the standard D&D elements (building strongholds etc.) are in place unless specifically said not to be. The hex descriptions mention numerous groups of people and their leaders. No details, but what would they be doing if not banding together to survive? I think the DM can read between the lines a little and make this stuff up easily.

[geoffrey]

My group has a lot of fun re-rolling HD before each combat. You get good luck just as often as bad luck. It's always a hoot to (for example) go from having 3 six-sided HD (4, 3, and 1) to having 3 twelve-sided HD (11, 8, and 6). We also like rolling handfuls of polyhedral dice. We are the polar opposite of those who don't like to roll dice or who don't like dice other than 6-siders.

The system also serves to make the PCs more cautious, even around relatively weak monsters. You never know when that 2 HD monster is going to have 20+ hp. I like when the PCs' first instinct when seeing a monster is to run from it or to sneak around it (which reminds me of much S&S literature), rather than whacking away with swords at everything that moves (which reminds me of video games).

I always expected the dice conventions to be the most controversial part of the book. (Boy was I surprised!) I included them not only because we find them a lot of fun, but because both of the first two D&D supplements included new dice conventions.

Of course, the dice conventions are not essential to Carcosa at all. We ourselves have adopted them only this year.

[geoffrey]

I am preparing a solution for those for whom Supplement V: CARCOSA is too graphic, but who are still interested in Carcosa.

Sometime in November I will be selling not one, but TWO versions of CARCOSA:

1. The first version is the exact version that I've been selling since Oct. 8th. Completely, totally unchanged. Not one word changed. Not one letter. It will always be for sale.

2. The second version (called the "Expurgated Edition") will have all the graphic violence edited out of the sorcerous rituals. I've done a rough draft of the edited version, and it's only 2 pages shorter than the original edition. The rituals in the Expurgated Edition will be no more controversial than the spells in the AD&D Players Handbook. Human sacrifice is still necessary for all of the rituals (save for those of banishment). But all details as to the age, gender, color, number, etc. of the sacrifices is edited out and left to the DM's imagination. Similarly, all the torments inflicted upon sacrifices, and the manner of their deaths, is edited out and left to the DM's imagination. Here is an example of an expurgated ritual:

Susurration of the Purple Cavern: This seven-hour ritual can be performed only in crystalline caves which have naturally-occurring amethysts amongst the crystals. The sorcerer must have a jagged knife of rainbow quartz. The ritual produces a haunting susurration that seduces and deludes the Violet Mist into willing bondage to the sorcerer. The susurration accompanies the sorcerer for 2-4 days, at which time the Violet Mist is no longer bound and will probably attack the sorcerer.

(Those who own a copy of CARCOSA will know what the jagged knife is for, and how the susurration is produced.)

So sometime in November everyone who orders a copy of CARCOSA will need to specify whether they want the "1st Edition" or the "Expurgated Edition".

Please do not send money for an Expurgated Edition now! They won't be ready to sell until sometime in November. I'll announce it when I'm ready to start selling them.

[blackbarn]

Well, it's sad that it came to this, but at least now some of the people on the fence can read it and see what they think of the supplement. I doubt anything you do will change the minds of a few who are dead set against it though.

[Bard]

Now, suddenly I have a feeling, that I'll have to buy both version... :-)

[Geiger]

Oct 24, 2008 5:50:43 GMT -6 Bard said:

Now, suddenly I have a feeling, that I'll have to buy both version... :-)

You are not the only one...

[geoffrey]

PDFs of Supplement V: CARCOSA are now available for $6.

[apeloverage]

Oct 29, 2008 12:47:28 GMT -6 geoffrey said:

PDFs of Supplement V: CARCOSA are now available for $6.

are you going to do a pdf of the expurgated version?

(sorry for double-fussiness ;D )

[geoffrey]

Oct 29, 2008 16:27:40 GMT -6 apeloverage said:

Oct 29, 2008 12:47:28 GMT -6 geoffrey said:

PDFs of Supplement V: CARCOSA are now available for $6.

are you going to do a pdf of the expurgated version?

(sorry for double-fussiness ;D )

Yes indeed! ;D I'm going to release the Expurgated Edition simultaneously in print and in PDF. Look for both in early November. (And I'll announce it on my blog and in this thread when they are released.)

[geoffrey]

The Expurgated Edition of Supplement V: CARCOSA is now available in both print and PDF.

Thus, you can choose amongst two versions and two formats:

) The 1st Edition is the unchanged, unaltered book that I’ve been selling ever since October 8, 2008.

2) The Expurgated Edition, which has no graphic violence.

Both the 1st Edition and the Expurgated Edition are available in both print and in PDF.

Go here for details:
carcosa-geoffrey.blogspot.com/2008/11/supplement-v-carcosa-is-now-available.html

[Thangobrind]

Oct 22, 2008 14:54:37 GMT -6 Greyharp said:

I only recently read my first Mars book by Burroughs, not to mention Thongor.

Thongor! You're venturing into some pretty rough literary terrain. Like most of Carter's work, it's a great concept, but the execution is on the poor side. Probably could mine it for some game material, I suppose.

I'd like to say...

(a) Hello to everybody! This is my first post, though I've been reading here for a while and loving what I'm seeing.

(b) Thank you, Geoff, for making such an awesome supplement. I have to admit that the hubbub surrounding Carcosa was pretty fascinating, and I might have passed it over if I hadn't seen how hot and bothered the RP Gamer community got over it. Incidentally, I thought you handled all that pretty well. Hopefully it helped sales rather than hindered them.

[apeloverage]

Dec 20, 2008 18:37:15 GMT -6 Thangobrind said:

Thongor! You're venturing into some pretty rough literary terrain. Like most of Carter's work, it's a great concept, but the execution is on the poor side. Probably could mine it for some game material, I suppose.

There's actually a free, unofficial Thongor role-playing game, at www.1km1kt.net/rpg/barbarians-of-lemuria . It was expanded into a paid game, but that one is 'generic' because they couldn't get the rights.

[geoffrey]

Dec 20, 2008 18:37:15 GMT -6 Thangobrind said:

Thank you, Geoff, for making such an awesome supplement. I have to admit that the hubbub surrounding Carcosa was pretty fascinating, and I might have passed it over if I hadn't seen how hot and bothered the RP Gamer community got over it. Incidentally, I thought you handled all that pretty well. Hopefully it helped sales rather than hindered them.

Thanks for the kind words. I'm glad you enjoy CARCOSA so much.

I've sold more copies of CARCOSA since its release on Oct. 8th than I thought I would EVER sell, so I don't think the controversy hurt sales.

[benoist]

I was wondering about the "Supplement V" nomenclature. Wouldn't Corcosa be technically Supplement VI, since "Swords & Spells" was the fifth supplement to OD&D?

Is it because Swords & Spells didn't actually bear the title of "Supplement V" on the cover?

[Finarvyn]

I think that many folks consider Swords & Spells to be a different and somewhat parallel game and not a true supplement for OD&D, so it's not just a "no name on the book" argument.

[benoist]

Makes sense. I was just wondering, in case someone, I don't know who that might be, would like you know... to write a Supplement VI or something. ;D

[geoffrey]

I asked the question about whether S&S was Supplement V here:
odd74.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=chainmail&action=display&thread=1258

Foster's reply, along with the fact that Supplement IV was described in that book's intro as the last D&D supplement, decided me on calling my book Supplement V: CARCOSA rather than Supplement VI.

I wholeheartedly love the idea of my fellow OD&D fans writing and publishing Supplement VI, Supplement VII, etc. More old-school goodness to fit in my little box! ;D

[Zulgyan]

Guess what arrived today with the mail...

[geoffrey]

Apr 6, 2009 15:31:13 GMT -6 Zulgyan said:

Guess what arrived today with the mail...

Glad to hear it! ;D