How Much Campaign Do You Need?

[inkmeister]

I was reading the blog of JDJarvis (I think he posts here, but I could be mixed up - he is on at least one of the old school boards, maybe K&K). The blog is Aeons and Auguries. This fellow did an inspiring post:

aeonsnaugauries.blogspot.com/2012/02/how-much-campaign-do-you-need.html#comment-form

The jist of it was that he wanted to see how much campaign could fit on 2 pages of paper (front and back, 4 total sides). He generated a gridded wilderness map, complete with 4 castles, 2 towns (with inns, prices, encounters, etc) , and 5 or 6 dungeons with their own respective maps (I think). If I understand correctly, he also had encounters for every grid location on his map.

I'm curious if others here prep in a similar way, or would find it lacking in some way to do so. How much campaign do you need? I find a minimalist approach very attractive, but I'm not at all confident in my own abilities to do much with so little. On the one hand, the classic town/dungeon setup is a proven approach, but there is something attractive about something so open-ended, and yet so minimalist, as what is presented above.

I'd love to hear what others think.

[zeraser]

Seems pretty neat to me. The only thing that seems to be missing (that is to say, the only thing that it's up to the PCs to contribute) is goals: Things to want, things to want to do, things to want to be, etc. Not a big problem, though; given at least one or two players who are willing to do the imagination-legwork of making up their own motivations, you should be set.

Frankly, I really like this kind of campaign - I love the notion of D&D as a game that requires as close to zero prep as possible, with rules that fit on a single page (and setting detail to match) and lots of narrative or dramatic or problem-solving energies unleashed spontaneously in play.

[blackbarn]

I like the minimalist approach, too. I often prepare things just for fun that way - nice, little concise settings for starting a campaign. Rarely do I get the chance to run them, but when I do, it's a breeze to add the rest on the fly. They never stay so simple, though, once the players start adding their input to the game as we play. It always snowballs, though I guess that is the point!

[thorswulf]

I've wondered for a while now if troupe style gaming might be a way to get a campaign like this moving. That is to say have each player create a high level character (lord or its equal) who controls a castle , tower, or whatever. They also generate a hero level character as that higher level's character main assistant. Finally they create a 1st level character or two to be flunkies who serve that lord and his assistant.

This allows players to have a direct impact on the environment, and adventure as per the norm. NPC lords, wizards, and rival priests add to the conflict.

[inkmeister]

I'd love to see if a 2 page campaign really can create a genuinely good play experience (of course allowing for the campaign to grow beyond two pages as time goes on). It's not that I doubt it can - I just don't know. All I know is that I'm working up a medium dungeon right now that already takes up more than 2 pages, and I have no neighboring town, or any setting at all beyond the dungeon, really.

I like how JDJarvis hit all the essential OD&D points, though; towns, castles (stocked), dungeons, and wilderness. A complete game (well, maybe lacking naval aspects) on 2 pages.

[Ynas Midgard]

I don't believe in the 2-page approach - but DO believe in, say, 4-6 pages. That should be enough for months of play.

[Vile Traveller]

When I first started gaming I thought I needed lots of pre-planned adventures and background for a campaign. I think it was Traveller that taught me to fly by the seat of my pants instead, not through any planning but just because there was no way to actually detail such a huge setting (this was in the CT days so there wasn't the huge, steaming pile of canon there is now). taking stock after a few years, I realised that both I and my players were having much more fun this way. From that point onward I've been a big fan of minimalist gaming.

There is a saying in Japanese garden design - "the garden is complete when nothing more can be taken away."

I'd still want a few dungeons in there, though.

[inkmeister]

Nice saying, Vile. I try to live that philosophy (minimalism) as much as possible - fewer possessions, fewer distractions, less stress, etc.

In music, I always used to want to compose elaborate, highly planned pieces. Truthfully I always loved JS Bach and wanted to write music like that. But I found my voice when I started doing free improvisation. My music was far more interesting, creative, and most importantly, fun. No real thought at all goes into it - just start playing!

I haven't reached that point with these games though. As a newcomer to running my own game, I'm overwhelmed with the possibilities, and feel an urge to prep too much. I look forward to that point where I break out and learn to go with the flow more.

Part of it for me, though, is that there is a certain joy to me as a player when I discover something in a game that I might have missed, but was there all along. It gives the sense of an impersonal, real, and magical world to explore. So that train of thought tends more towards the heavy planning path. I think ultimately there is a much better balance (and probably much more towards minimalism) that a lot of you have already discovered.

[benoist]

I don't even think you really need that much to start a campaign, with the attitude of extrapolating later and making the world grow, that is.

In my mind, and following the advice of Underworld and Wilderness Adventures, all you really need for the first session is a main level for your dungeon, with maybe a few ideas for eventual connections to other levels, a sketch of the wilderness around, including the fall-back position/village/whatnot the players will go back to to heal, sell their goods and whatever else they need doing.

So, with that in mind, I think you can totally fit that on a single recto verso sheet of paper. One side for the dungeon level with a brief key, shorthand for connections and so on, and the other side for the wilderness sketch, and a few ideas concerning the main establishments and/or NPCs of the town. Then, start the players either at the entrance of the dungeon with a mule and a few hired hands (or right in the middle of it if they're prisoners just starting the game as they escape or whatnot), and you can rock' n roll with that alone for a couple of games.

You'll need to expand on that very fast, of course, and having more right off the bat, like for instance more fleshed out levels connecting to the main one as proposed in U&WA, is a good idea.

[talysman]

It's hard to tell without seeing JD's actual two-page campaign notes, but I think he's not counting the dungeon maps as part of the notes, just maybe some one- or two-phrase descriptions of several local dungeons. And with that assumption, I think the two-page campaign is completely doable, even preferable (to me.)

For hamlets and villages, assume it's nothing more than a core of 2d6 buildings at a crossroads or near a ford across the river, plus farm houses scattered over a couple hundred yards. That way, you could skip village maps at the start and only fill them in as needed. A town or city might need to be mapped, at least in part, but there are tricks you could use here, too.

[Deleted]

One of my all time favourite threads on this forum is Zulgyan's The One-Page Manifesto, for which JD's two-page campaign description is perfectly suited. The way I see it is that you'd have the two-page (single piece of paper) campaign description, with each element (town, city, dungeon, etc., being in the one-page dungeon format. Personally, while loving the fluff, I think this is really all I need to run a campaign.

[inkmeister]

Austrodavicus - awesome link, man! Thanks!

[machfront]

I don't need even a full page for a campaign, honestly.

The few paragraphs of background featured in The Keep on the Borderlands is more than enough to fire my imagination, but I'll admit I like a few more snippets thrown in.

I loved the brief affair this site and handful of blogs had with the 'One-sheet' stuff (like Zulgyan's post, linked above). I wish there had been more, and I wish it had continued to be a permanent fixture of old-school forums and blogs.

I had these glorious visions of stuff from folks more inventive and imaginative than I. Like a slim book that gave a one-page world, further subdivided to one-page nations, each having one-page areas (major/key wildernesses, towns, cities, etc.) to come to about a 64 page book...'bout the size of Moldvay Basic actually. That would, for the likes of me, be way more than enough that I'd ever need and ever read.

[machfront]

Come to think of it... the approx. 25-30 pages of campaign world info in WFRP 1st ed. is more than enough. So, I guess from my viewpoint, only about that much to as little as half that is all that a campaign needs for my taste.

[mordrene]

This has definately stirred the creative juices. i have begun my "mini" campaign creation now. first sheet has campaign map and notes on locations. now to see where this leads. Thanks for the post.

[inkmeister]

Yesterday I just finished a single page (one side) with 5 dungeon maps on it, all to comprise a 5 level dungeon. I would estimate the total room count at easily 150. Some levels are big, some pretty small. I have my doubts as to whether I can key the whole thing on one side, though I am definitely digging the very minimal approach to keying dungeons.

Dungeons are pretty easy for me (well, stocking is still my weak point, but overall, I feel good). The other campaign elements, especially wilderness and towns, are my weak point.

I definitely intend to move in the direction of the one page approach.

Mordrene, I'd definitely be curious to hear how your mini campaign develops!

[noffham]

Let me tell you about minimal. It was the second or third week our group had been playing and my friend Bob excitedly announced that he had a dungeon he wanted to run. So he was the GM that day. After 35 minutes of walking around corridors and fighting random monsters with little to no treasure I turned to to Bob and asked, "You do have rooms in here right?"

The "oh crap" look on Bob's face was priceless. We decided to jump back into my campaign.

Good times, good times...

[jjarvis]

My experiment was 4 pages really, both sides of 2 sheets. There is no grand goal but a little exploration and interaction with npcs should build a few. Each castle lord is different enough from each other that pc interaction should generate a few goals. Wilderness encounter tables from the game of choice should be added. There's always room for more detail of course but that need not all be figured out at campaign start and if things feel limited or cramped a couple more sheets doubles the choices available.

[talysman]

I was going to say, JD, after you left that comment on my blog, that maybe the ODD74 forum might like to know more about your process.

In general, I think you can save a lot of room by focusing on differences instead of detailing everything included. A town's a town, the world around, at least in medieval FRPGs, so you really only need to note what's different; primary economic activity can be reduced to a word or two ("fishing town") and political situation may be just one short sentence ("senile heirless baron and ambitious steward vs. secret death cult".) More detail gets added in play if the players choose to explore those elements.

[Vile Traveller]

Oct 28, 2012 13:06:39 GMT -6 talysman said:

In general, I think you can save a lot of room by focusing on differences instead of detailing everything included.

That's a pretty nifty idea. Brilliant in its simplicity, even.

[machfront]

Oct 28, 2012 12:23:08 GMT -6 jjarvis said:

My experiment was 4 pages really, both sides of 2 sheets.

And yet no pdf of same on your blog. Gives me the sads.


But, in general response to the thread,....
I know my own longest running campaign world (began with RC D&D, on to B/X, then to T&T where it remained until the end), my notes out of years of play totaled not even a full sheet of notebook paper were I to write it properly.
It was couple of pages, front and back, of randomly placed phrases and bits: "They were a**holes.", "true form only visible through teary eyes", "Stormfront (lg. town): All here have accepted the end.", "the merc is Richard Burton in The Wild Geese", "Everything cursed....depression...suicide...if they're lucky.", etc.,etc. blah, blah, blah....

Years. A page.

Years.