B-Series modules with ODD?

[Scott Anderson]

I would like to use some of my old B series modules in a LBB+ game. What changes should I need to make?

[strangebrew]

I think the changes would be so minor that it wouldn't be worth stressing over. B1 and B2 were both included in the Holmes basic set, which is basically LLB+Greyhawk. The '77 version of B2 is different from the '81 version, but I think the details are minor. B1 also might have been revised post-'81, I'm not sure. Either way it should be a breeze.

[Finarvyn]

I agree. Most early TSR modules seem to work equally well with OD&D, B/X D&D, or AD&D. Sometimes a hit point total might be a couple points high or low, or an AC value a point high or low, but I don't stress that stuff. Mostly, I think they can be run pretty much as written.

[Deleted]

The only major difference that I can think of off the top of my head is the inclusion of electrum and platinum pieces in B2 which means you have to convert some of the treasures into an equivalent amount of gold pieces which is a really small thing but can be annoying.

[Finarvyn]

Good point. I often "wing it" with gold, etc, and don't always follow a module for those numbers because I like control over how much loot is out there. Same with magic items. I guess I was thinking more about the adventure itself, in terms of locations and critters and encounters. I ought to have commented more about the cash side of things.

[Scott Anderson]

One thing I intend to do is change the loot a little bit. I have one solid idea that I am certain about: ALL MAGIC SWORDS ARE AWESOME. There was a SW supplement that came out for 2013 appreciation day that deals with magic swords.

NO MORE CRAPPY SWORDS +1. ALL MAGIC SWORDS ARE AWESOME!

Other little changes: wood from the Rowan tree can be made into shields which in turn may be splintered to nullify a spell.
Old coins from dungeons is "taxed" at 10% before you can spend it, because the local lords all have the right of seigniorage.
More treasure than the modules give, but in the form of trade goods. If you can lug it out, you can level up faster.

We will start without the thief class. Everybody is a FM, C or MU or combination. If the campaign lasts, we will add them as an NPC class after 12 months and then as a choice for PCs after 14 months.

Come to think of it, I miss well post my house rules booklets. They run to about 12 pages, but almost all of it is reference material like equipment lists and encumbrance rules, and half of it is in a big font.

There is one change I made of note to the character races: all demi-men receive a -2 penalty to reaction rolls with races other than their own. Elves are elitist pricks, dwarfs are rude curmudgeons, and nobody listens to hobbits.

[makofan]

Mar 27, 2015 11:07:35 GMT -6 Scott Anderson said:

There is one change I made of note to the character races: all demi-men receive a -2 penalty to reaction rolls with races other than their own. Elves are elitist pricks, dwarfs are rude curmudgeons, and nobody listens to hobbits.

I love this!

[Porphyre]

I have it both ways. I roll a six-sider along with the reaction roll, and adjust according to it :
1 : minus 2
2-3: minus 1
4-5: plus 1
6: plus 2.
"Love it or hate it" in other terms: people are either subjugated by the elves fey awesomeness, or put off by their eldritch weirdness. Dwarves are either valued for their reliability and hard working ethics, or seen as gruffy little men with no social skills. Hobbits are endearing to some, ridiculous and irritating to others (like Gygax himself)

[Red Baron]

You tend to have a lot of second level fighters with 15 hit points and an AC0. In OD&D that's 4+ hit dice, and harder to hit than a demon!

[Falconer]

Mar 26, 2015 1:15:55 GMT -6 strangebrew said:

The '77 version of B2 is different from the '81 version, but I think the details are minor.

Minor, perhaps, but I would definitely seek out the original B2 (early 1980). Just look for a copy with the TSR "wizard" logo on the front, not the TSR "face" logo. The changes to the Moldvay version (late 1980, by Moldvay himself, I believe) are made specifically to conform to that edition. The most gonzo treasure is gimped. It’s just not as cool.

I agree that any of these can be run with OD&D with virtually no changes. When running B4, I did have the Rules Cyclopedia handy just so I could reference the monsters, some of which were Moldvay’s own creation. But I just ran them as-written; I didn’t think it necessary to remove them because they didn’t exist in OD&D.

Mar 27, 2015 9:55:18 GMT -6 @mkv said:

The only major difference that I can think of off the top of my head is the inclusion of electrum and platinum pieces in B2 which means you have to convert some of the treasures into an equivalent amount of gold pieces which is a really small thing but can be annoying.

Isn’t there electrum and platinum in OD&D?

[Deleted]

In volume two it makes a reference that these types of coins can be added and suggests the values for them that eventually became accepted but they are not in the treasure tables or the currency chart

[strangebrew]

Mar 30, 2015 13:57:17 GMT -6 Falconer said:

Minor, perhaps, but I would definitely seek out the original B2 (early 1980). Just look for a copy with the TSR "wizard" logo on the front, not the TSR "face" logo. The changes to the Moldvay version (late 1980, by Moldvay himself, I believe) are made specifically to conform to that edition. The most gonzo treasure is gimped. It’s just not as cool.

I have both versions of B2 back in the USA, the biggest difference between to two being the wand of magic missiles being switched to a wand of enemy detection. I'm playing through B2 now (latter version, off of a pdf) and the party just recently recovered the wand of enemy detection from the gelatinous cube. They were pretty excited, but if only they knew, if only they knew...

I also have been nixing the +1 items like Scott was talking about above. There are so many in B2 its fairly ridiculous, so most of them I just made into normal swords. The rest I changed into something more interesting, with an evocative unique name and an additional power or benefit. It makes finding a magical item much more magical.

[Falconer]

Pretty sure it’s a wand of fireballs in the original. >

[rastusburne]

I didn't even realise there were different versions of B2...

Has anyone made a comprehensive list of differences, or if we're being realistic, is it pretty minimal - just a magic item or two here and there?

[waysoftheearth]

As discussed at excessive length elsewhere on this forum, the first print of B2 uses slightly different language in the introductory passage on running combat which (from memory) is consistent with the language appearing in Holmes.

The first print also includes a dexterity stat for all monsters (to determine initiative Holmes style).

The first print has a slightly smaller typeface, and so includes four pieces of art not present in later prints. However, there is also one piece in later prints not found in the first.

Area 63 does indeed have a wand of fireballs in the 1st

Area 62 has a flaming sword instead of a sword +1, and a helm of evil! instead of a helm of alignment change.

There's probably a bunch more magic item changes too...

[rastusburne]

Ahh I see, thanks for that.

[Zenopus]

There's a list of the B2 differences here at the Acaeum.

[Falconer]

Wow, the 3rd Printing changes are even worse than I thought! Those removed pieces of art are iconic, to me. And they ditched the Realm? *runs screaming*

[rastusburne]

Yep, some significant changes between 2nd and 3rd printing/edition. I have a feeling my copy is 3rd

[Scott Anderson]

Mine is a later printing. I just went to check. But it's not like the magic item changes are set in stone.

[gonyaulax]

Mar 27, 2015 11:07:35 GMT -6 Scott Anderson said:

Come to think of it, I miss well post my house rules booklets. They run to about 12 pages, but almost all of it is reference material like equipment lists and encumbrance rules, and half of it is in a big font.

I would very much like to see this. If you don't get them posted, could you send me a private message? I love "collecting" house rules to browse through. I find that going over others' ideas greatly stimulates my own creativity!

Gonyaulax, now in Nebraska

[Scott Anderson]

Here are the house rules booklets:

Quick Start Guide 1- Ability Scores, Races, Classes
Quick Start Guide 2- Equipment, Hirelings, Movement and
 Encumbrance
Quick Start Guide 3- House Rules

Here's the DM's guide (1 page)
Time Tracker Sheet for the DM


Order of Events table reference
Adventure Session Record for the players

We use this calendar even though we're not in Mystara.  It's good for the days, weeks, months and holy days.

And here's a year of weather reports.

[gonyaulax]

Scott,

Thanks for the documents! They are very well organized and seem quite complete and are well suited to handing out to players for their use during a game. (Plus, I like the art!) I especially like the Time Tracker as, for me, no easy way to track time moving from a small scale to a large one. This chart may do the trick.

I have a few questions:

1. On page 4 of the Equipment booklet (Quick Start 2), in the heading of the Hirelings table, part of the heading states "Cost in gp per week*". Is the intent for the asterisk to direct attention to the statement in bold directly above the table? If not, what is the asterisk for?

2. On the page of the House Rules (Quick Start 3), under "House Rules of Note", you state "Characters rolled tic-tac-toe style". I'm not sure that I follow this. Would you briefly elaborate?

3. Also in that same paragraph, you state "Hit points will be rerolled every level up (adding at least one hit point per level)." I take this to mean that when (for example) a character goes from five hit dice to six, you would have the player re-roll all six dice, making sure that the new total is at least one point higher than the old total. This is interesting, if I am reading that correctly. We always used to just have the player roll one additional die of the correct type and add that to the character's old total. I'm not sure that either method has an advantage over the other, both methods would average out the good and bad rolls in the long run, but your method would cause a player a greater feeling of anxiety every time he leveled up!

Again, all in all these are a great collection of summarized rules and charts and I greatly appreciate you sharing them.

Gonyaulax, now residing in Nebraska

[Scott Anderson]

Gonyaulax, thank you for taking a look.

1. And 3.: you are exactly right.

2. Tic-tac-toe style is this: mark down a tic-tac-toe board. Roll 3d6 nine times, placing the numbers into the boxes in order. Then write "S, D, C" across the top to mark the columns, and "I, W, Ch" on the side to mark the rows. A number can be assigned to an ability score corresponding to its row or its column, but not to both. A seventh number is multiplied by ten for starting gold. This gives players some chance to model a particular character idea but keeps scores in the average human range.

[strangebrew]

Mar 31, 2015 20:35:54 GMT -6 Falconer said:

Pretty sure it’s a wand of fireballs in the original. >

D'oh! You're right of course. I must have got my wires crossed, I remember it being a wand of something ridiculously powerful and magic missiles isn't quite that.