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Post by Finarvyn on May 19, 2014 9:40:52 GMT -6
I was thinking about running some sort of Cthuhlu-OD&D blend, which got me thinking a couple of things:
(1) OD&D has the potential for "dump stats" which are non-combat (INT, WIS, CHA).
(2) CoC makes use of mental type things such as "sanity" which don't exist in OD&D.
My thought was that if we have so many under-valued stats already, then creating more would be useless so perhaps a solution would be to find better uses for the stats that we already have.
What do you think about this?
INT = this could be a sort of "mental attack strength" number for those who can do this sort of thing.
WIS = this could represent sanity.
CHA = this could be a psychic sensitivity.
Another thought I had was to combine two stats to create new stats. This might be something like:
Psychic Sensitivity = INT + CHA
Psychic Defense (Sanity) = WIS + CHA
Psychic Attack = INT + WIS
Anyone done anything like this? What do you think?
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Post by makofan on May 19, 2014 10:27:42 GMT -6
My only comment is keep it simple. I like your first option better for that reason
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2014 10:51:18 GMT -6
I've been working on a home brewed version of psionics for some time and have done something similar. Although I only use Int. for psionic attack and Wis. for psionic defense. Charisma is used to check for the overall strength of one's psionic power. I think using wisdom to represent sanity is a valid option and that one can equate loosing points in wisdom (whether temporary or permanent) with loosing sanity.
Actually I think the concept of various and specific attack forms could in fact deal ability score damage (over say level drain for undead). Inspired to come up with a rough table for this now:
Monster.................Attack (on hit)
Ghoul...................1 point perm. Con. drain,and paralysis (or d3 temp drain)
Wight...................1 point perm. Str. drain (or d3 temp drain)
Wraith..................1 point perm. Str. and Con. drain (or d3 temp drain)
Mummy...................1 point perm. Str., Dex., and Con drain (or d3 temp drain)
Specter.................2 point perm. Con. drain (or d6 temp drain)
Vampire.................2 point perm. Str. and Con. drain (or d6 temp drain)
I'm not exactly sure what sort of monsters would likely cause intelligence, wisdom or charisma drain or how, though mechanically it would work similar to the above. I feel that one full day of rest sounds appropriate for each point of temporary ability score loss. As for loss of points from multiple ability scores, each point lost requires a full days rest (i.e. one cannot recover both a point in strength and constitution in a single day). I think its interesting none the less.
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Post by Finarvyn on May 19, 2014 13:00:44 GMT -6
You could use stat drain as an alternative to level drain for undead. Those are probably physical stats (STR, DEX, CON) but some creatures like Mind Flayers could eat up mental stats.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2014 21:10:36 GMT -6
Well, the "Random Harlot Table" was in AD&D, not...
oh, HORROR stats. Never mind.
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Post by Necropraxis on May 22, 2014 16:24:45 GMT -6
I have seen this elsewhere:
Intelligence as mental dexterity, wisdom as mental constitution/willpower, charisma as mental force/strength.
Not sure exactly how that would work out for psychic powers, but maybe wisdom is resilience or HP, charisma determines attack capability (either attack bonus or what table to roll on), and intelligence is the AC or defense?
Credit to Ian B. for the basic conceptualization.
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Post by Porphyre on May 24, 2014 5:31:32 GMT -6
One reason I don't like the idea of using Charisma stat for psychic powers in a Horror setting is that it doesnt make room for a character like "Carrie": the "ugly duckling" and underdog with tremendous hidden power.
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Post by sepulchre on May 24, 2014 9:28:59 GMT -6
Porphyre, looking to Deities and Demigods, lower and negative charisma evokes negative reaction adj. and horror. Conceptually, you could fit that to whatever dice you wish to use.
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Post by cooper on May 24, 2014 13:24:31 GMT -6
Stats would take the "horror" out of it for me as the player starts ticking off points instead of having his character react a certain way. I don't think there is any need to reinvent the wheel, the psionic rules in Elderitch Wizardry are quite lovecraftian, psionics didn't become "sci-fi" until ad&d. Instead of rolling randomly for psionics, you can have "black books" that hold eldritch secrets. Everyones sanity/psionic score is as written d100 at the start of play. Treat all otherworldly monsters as having psionic blast or whatever. The effects of a failed saving throw on non-psionics (fear, insanity, catatonia) is the horror effect.
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Post by tombowings on May 25, 2014 5:15:38 GMT -6
I have seen this elsewhere: Intelligence as mental dexterity, wisdom as mental constitution/willpower, charisma as mental force/strength. Not sure exactly how that would work out for psychic powers, but maybe wisdom is resilience or HP, charisma determines attack capability (either attack bonus or what table to roll on), and intelligence is the AC or defense? Credit to Ian B. for the basic conceptualization. No. It wasn't. I got it from one of Wizards of the Coast's boards during the 3E era. All I did was apply it to horror. |
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Post by sepulchre on May 25, 2014 21:02:21 GMT -6
Cooper wrote:
Psionic strength points are effectively a stat and psionic combat results in a bit of book keeping.
I employed the psionic blast tables in the past in the very same way you suggest, and it works well enough. Eventually, I just switched to the morale dice with similar effects.
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Post by rredmond on May 26, 2014 8:01:43 GMT -6
One reason I don't like the idea of using Charisma stat for psychic powers in a Horror setting is that it doesnt make room for a character like "Carrie": the "ugly duckling" and underdog with tremendous hidden power. That's the cool thing about Charisma though, it can be hidden. I guess that can be said of any attribute, but I'm just thinking of a friend who played a paladin who was on a secret quest and didn't want others in our party to know he was a paladin, so he played down the high CHA he had and etc. Also, IIRC, charisma (as an attribute) means more than just physical beauty. But however you play it, Carrie (to me) was a beaten down girl with no confidence in herself and that made her project (and present) as physically unattractive. But really her high Charisma (and thus powers) were hidden... until exactly the right (wrong?) time. But: Porphyre, looking to Deities and Demigods, lower and negative charisma evokes negative reaction adj. and horror. Conceptually, you could fit that to whatever dice you wish to use. Man, what a great point this is! --Ron-- |
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Post by Necropraxis on May 26, 2014 9:14:33 GMT -6
Credit to Ian B. for the basic conceptualization. No. It wasn't. I got it from one of Wizards of the Coast's boards during the 3E era. All I did was apply it to horror. Different Ian B., but still an Ian B. I'd disambiguate further, but I don't like using folks' full names on forums. Sorry for the confusion. |
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premmy
Level 5 Thaumaturgist
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Post by premmy on May 27, 2014 17:23:13 GMT -6
Monster.................Attack (on hit) Ghoul...................1 point perm. Con. drain,and paralysis (or d3 temp drain) Wight...................1 point perm. Str. drain (or d3 temp drain) Wraith..................1 point perm. Str. and Con. drain (or d3 temp drain) Mummy...................1 point perm. Str., Dex., and Con drain (or d3 temp drain) Specter.................2 point perm. Con. drain (or d6 temp drain) Vampire.................2 point perm. Str. and Con. drain (or d6 temp drain) I'm not exactly sure what sort of monsters would likely cause intelligence, wisdom or charisma drain or how, though mechanically it would work similar to the above. Actually, I think incorporeal undead would be excellent for draining those. After all, they don't have a body, so why should they damage the victim's bodily attributes. Also, ranged effects of various sorts might be good - the gaze/very sight of the creature is so maddening it harms your mind. On another note, I like the "d6 or so" temporary drain that heals 1 point per day - I've played in campaigns like that, and the effects was sufficiently scary. As an alternative to paralysing touches such as the Ghoul's, I'd suggest Dexterity drain rather than Constitution, since that's a better translation of "slowing you down". |
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jdjarvis
Level 4 Theurgist
Hmmm,,,, had two user names, I'll be using this one from now on.
Posts: 123
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Post by jdjarvis on May 28, 2014 9:24:37 GMT -6
You could do horror with stats we already have. A save vs fear does the trick. Players don't like beingforced to flee however so the trick is to encourage flight but not force it by "subtle" application of penalties. for example: fail a save vs fear and be -2 to hit and saves and only strike for 1/2 damage until you can put distance between yourself and the source of the fear and/or rest for 10 minutes. Aversion to potentially facing a failed save vs fear is going to create a layer of tension and droppign the penalty is goign to encourage some to flee.
What are folks afraid of? Demons, undead, eldritch horrors I suppose all of them could require a fear save on exposure to anything of say 1/2 your level or grater in HD to anything that would be feared.
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Post by rredmond on May 30, 2014 8:39:46 GMT -6
You could do horror with stats we already have. A save vs fear does the trick. Players don't like beingforced to flee however so the trick is to encourage flight but not force it by "subtle" application of penalties. for example: fail a save vs fear and be -2 to hit and saves and only strike for 1/2 damage until you can put distance between yourself and the source of the fear and/or rest for 10 minutes. Aversion to potentially facing a failed save vs fear is going to create a layer of tension and droppign the penalty is goign to encourage some to flee. What are folks afraid of? Demons, undead, eldritch horrors I suppose all of them could require a fear save on exposure to anything of say 1/2 your level or grater in HD to anything that would be feared. That's a fantastic idea! I really like that one. If you're a monster, like an 18/00 Conan type or whatever, you can take the penalties and fight through the fear. Thanks, wonderful idea! --Ron-- |
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jdjarvis
Level 4 Theurgist
Hmmm,,,, had two user names, I'll be using this one from now on.
Posts: 123
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Post by jdjarvis on May 30, 2014 9:41:19 GMT -6
Another idea for horror and fear. If something almost kills a character there's a chance that character develops a phobia towards that source of near death and as such face -2 to hit and save when facing that threat until they defeat that threat a number of times equal to their level (yup a phobia could be troublesome and stick with a character for a while in such a scheme). It's not a curse so remove curse will not liberate the victim but other means to address insanity/madness may do the trick.
What constitutes almost killing a character would vary from campaign to campaign of course and I'd recommend a save to avoid developing a phobia not just a flat out acquisition of such things.
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