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Post by havard on Nov 4, 2009 14:32:22 GMT -6
FFC p 86:
"River Routes were fun, what with stray galleys and merchant ships ready to swarm over you. Plus the Picts who inhabited the few islands in the area."
Emphasis mine.
What, Picts? in the Dismal Swamp? The parapgraph is taken from the section about Loch Gloomen. Who are these people?
Could they be related to the Valemen (who might be Welsh?)?
The FFC keeps surprising me. This is the only reference to Picts I can find anywhere.
Havard
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Post by snorri on Nov 4, 2009 14:52:14 GMT -6
The real mystery is that they don't appears in Chainmail! You could fonds scots, but no picts. A Conan resurgence ?
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Post by havard on Nov 4, 2009 15:28:17 GMT -6
The real mystery is that they don't appears in Chainmail! You could fonds scots, but no picts. A Conan resurgence ? Very likely. AFAIK, there isnt much in terms of historical sources describing the Picts at all, so REH's Conan might be a better source for fleshing them out. Havard |
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Post by havard on Nov 11, 2009 16:12:52 GMT -6
I got ahold of some even older material which also mentions Picts living in the swamps....
Havard
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Post by havard on Nov 15, 2009 12:04:56 GMT -6
I just talked to Bob Meyer (by way of email) and he suggested the Picts may have been Orcs.... I guess that could be used to give us more information about what the Orcs of Blackmoor were really like!  Havard |
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Post by snorri on Nov 15, 2009 13:41:52 GMT -6
I just talked to Bob Meyer (by way of email) and he suggested the Picts may have been Orcs.... It's seems possible. Orcs and picts are strongly linked, because of the Orkneys. Orc" is usually interpreted as a Pictish tribal name meaning "young pig" or "young boar".The old Irish Gaelic name for the islands was Insi Orc ("island of the pigs").(quote from en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orkney) I guess the "pig-faced orcs", which are so different from Tolkien's ones, come from that link between pigs and orks. |
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Post by Finarvyn on Nov 15, 2009 16:31:16 GMT -6
I got ahold of some even older material which also mentions Picts living in the swamps.... Hey, you sort of slid this past us, Havard. What "even older material" are you talking about? |
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Post by havard on Dec 16, 2009 18:19:11 GMT -6
I got ahold of some even older material which also mentions Picts living in the swamps.... Hey, you sort of slid this past us, Havard. What "even older material" are you talking about? I have acquired a letter Dave sent to the C&C society when he first concieved Blackmoor. I have no idea how old it is, or whether it could be similar to what was printed in the Domesday Book. Unfortunately, I was asked not to share the letter with anyone, at least for now. I guess mentioning some of its content will be okay though Havard |
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Post by Garolek Dolgarukii on Dec 16, 2009 19:09:14 GMT -6
There are a handful of records from the Roman invasion of Britain describing battles with the Picts. I think that the most important thing to point out is that Picts would have low morale - if the battle is not going their way, they disappear into the wilds. The would seek revenge using stealth and hit-and-run tactics. Destroying a Pictish stronghold is no way to subjugate a tribe, they simply melt away and come back again and again to harrass the invaders.
Some folks take the Picts described by the Romans to be the same as the Cruitne in Irish annals, and some words in Gaelic dictionaries are ascribed a Pictish origin.
Even after the Christianization of Britain, some folks identified themselves as Picts, I have seen a book written by a churchman describing "Pictish History", but it was basically indistinguishable from mainline Scottish history after Kenneth MacAlpin.
The degenerate Picts described by REH bear a very strong resemblance to how Jordanes describes the Huns in "Deeds of the Goths"... From my hazy memory, something like "They have shapeless lumps for heads, beady sunken eyes, are stunted in growth, have bow legs, speak no human language but they always hold their head up high"
That description in turn is mirrored by JRRT's description of the orcs.
I use Picts in my own campaign, but paint them in a more noble light. I don't use orcs per se, but I do have a human tribe, the Skuun, who are orcs statistically. They are horse nomads, and evil pillagers almost to a man.
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