OD&D Marching Orders

[tom]

Hi everyone

I have a question that I'd be very interested in finding the answer to and thought perhaps someone on this forum may have the answer!

I've been thinking about marching orders in D&D. I took it for granted that somewhere in the OD&D rulebooks there would be some mention of the concept, but there isn't... and I've had a studious look at many zine articles written by Gary but still can't find any mention of it...

So the question I have is, does anyone know when the concept of asking for an order of march first appeared in D&D? I have a feeling it may be module B1 written by Mike Carr, but I'm wondering if there was an earlier reference.

[yesmar]

Jun 28, 2024 13:51:47 GMT -6 tom said:

So the question I have is, does anyone know when the concept of asking for an order of march first appeared in D&D? I have a feeling it may be module B1 written by Mike Carr, but I'm wondering if there was an earlier reference.

The Dungeons & Dragons Game Reference Sheet (with a 1976 TSR copyright) has a MARCH ORDER section with 3 rows of 3 blank lines (ostensibly for character names/numbers). I don’t know of any other references to marching order offhand, but that’s not to say that they don’t exist.

[tom]

That's interesting. In AD&D (I believe) there was something about up to 3 characters max in a 10' space (if they had short weapons). I know this is only a reference sheet but it suggests in 1976 players may have approached this in a much more abstract way, i.e. no more than 12 characters on a dungeon delve, keeping a single formation of 3 abreast max throughout.

[hamurai]

Jun 29, 2024 0:13:16 GMT -6 tom said:

In AD&D (I believe) there was something about up to 3 characters max in a 10' space (if they had short weapons).

That's also in B1: In Search of the Unknown. In 10' corridors, normally it's 2 characters side by side, or 3 with short weapons like daggers, hand axes and similar.

[yesmar]

Relevant passage from Vol. 3 (p. 12): “There can be places where 300 Hobgoblins dwell, but how many can come abreast down a typical passage in the dungeons? Allow perhaps 3 in a ten foot wide passage, and the balance will either be behind the front rank or fanning out to come upon the enemy by other routes. The most fearsome man or monster can be overwhelmed by sheer numbers of smaller/weaker creatures provided the latter are able to close!”

[tombowings]

An except from Empire of the Petal Throne (1975):

[yesmar]

Relatedly, GREYHAWK p. 15 specifies space requirements for several weapons. My favorite of these restrictions is pikes and pole arms “not [being] usable in dungeons as a general rule due to length.”

[Zenopus]

Holmes Basic, July 1977, has the following in the "Dungeon Mastering As a Fine Art" section:

...
Caller "O.K., everybody, into the secret passage."
D.M. "In what order?"
Caller "Elf in front. Fighter behind him. Dwarf will
close the door and bring up the rear."
...

This example could be played with maps and pencil and paper. If miniature figures are used, they can be arranged in battle order on the table top and the movement through passages and rooms imagined, the pieces rearranged for combat or other changes of formation. Figures are available for all the character types of Dungeons & Dragons as well as for most of the monsters.

This is all in the Holmes manuscript word-for-word, so was written by Holmes (and finished before Feb 1977). It's not surprising because he was a big fan of using miniatures in his games (he mentions minis at least five other times in the published rulebook). He uses the term "battle order" rather than "marching order" but with the reference to movement it's clear he's talking about the same thing.

On page 20, in the section of Combat, there's also:

Characters can be attacked by more than one opponent at a time; the Dungeon Master should be guided by the actual placement of the figures on a paper sketch or on the table in deciding how many opponents can engage as melee starts, always keeping in mind the dimensions of the dungeon itself. One would not expect to get more than two or three figures fighting side by side in a ten foot corridor, for example.

The 2-3 per 10 feet here is presumably derived from the Vol 3 guidance and the Greyhawk weapon length restrictions quoted by yesmar above. Also, this was the year before the module B1, so the guidance in there was probably building on this.

[Zenopus]

Jun 28, 2024 17:12:54 GMT -6 yesmar said:

Jun 28, 2024 13:51:47 GMT -6 tom said:

So the question I have is, does anyone know when the concept of asking for an order of march first appeared in D&D? I have a feeling it may be module B1 written by Mike Carr, but I'm wondering if there was an earlier reference.

The Dungeons & Dragons Game Reference Sheet (with a 1976 TSR copyright) has a MARCH ORDER section with 3 rows of 3 blank lines (ostensibly for character names/numbers). I don’t know of any other references to marching order offhand, but that’s not to say that they don’t exist.

For anyone interested, you can see a copy of this Reference Sheet here: tomeoftreasures.com/tot_dnd/miscellaneous/1975_gamesheet.htm

I've also seen a version with a 1975 copyright date.

They were apparently only used internally at TSR, and are vanishingly rare, so probably not much direct influence outside of TSR, but definitely a piece of puzzle in how these ideas originated and then slowly promulgated outwards to the community.