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Post by geoffrey on Aug 24, 2023 9:14:53 GMT -6
I received an email this morning from the Troll Lords announcing the following: Gary Gygax Returns! We are very happy to announce that Troll Lord Games, in conjunction with the estate of E. Gary Gygax, and Luke Gygax, is at long last able to bring the works of the Father of Role Playing back to the gaming table! This has been something we have desired for 15 years and something we are beyond ecstatic to make happen! For everyone here at Troll Lord Games, and for all of you out there, and for the legacy of E. Gary Gygax, this is a wonderful day. A glorious day! We need to show the Estate Managers the real value of this material and to do that we have already announced and launched the Pre-order for the Classic Yggsburgh Fantasy Campaign Setting. Written by Gary Gygax and first published in 2005, this classic work is full to the brim with gaming content. This will be the original version of this work as written by Gary and published by TLG. It includes two maps, one by our Lady of Gaming, Darlene! We aren't changing anything but the Stock Code on the spine! Castle Zagyg Vol I: Yggsburgh, consists of the walled Town of Yggsburgh with over 20,000 persons, and its environs, which includes many communities such as the thorp of Garham and 60 different geographic locales, each with their own peculiarities and adventures. The map charts over 1500 square miles of adventuring terrain, allowing the inclusion of Yggsburgh and Environs into almost any fantasy campaign setting. Each geographic locale has one or more adventures associated with it, offering hundreds of different plots, themes and escapades, players can take their characters on. It is a 256 page, hardback (smyth-sewn), book with one 24 x 30 inch double-sided, full color map by Darlene! It retails for $39.95. It is designed for play with the Castle & Crusades® Role Playing Game, but ports into many other RPGs, old and new, with minimal effort. Reserve Your Copy Today!!  |
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Post by jeffb on Aug 24, 2023 9:31:46 GMT -6
Just saw the email.
Woot!
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Post by mgtremaine on Aug 24, 2023 11:19:55 GMT -6
Me too... Now we hold our breath and wait for the next steps..... (oh please please please bring back the Castle!!!!!.)
-Mike
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Post by jeffb on Aug 24, 2023 11:44:09 GMT -6
Email states price is $39.95.
Link in email to product indicates $65.00
?
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Post by geoffrey on Aug 24, 2023 13:35:34 GMT -6
Email states price is $39.95. Link in email to product indicates $65.00 ? Yeah, that puzzles me too. |
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Post by Zenopus on Aug 24, 2023 14:01:45 GMT -6
Email states price is $39.95. Link in email to product indicates $65.00 ? Yeah, that puzzles me too. Over in the parallel DF thread, foster1941 mentioned that the $39.95 is the original MSRP. It looks to me that in the email they simply cut-and-pasted some of their old ad copy without proofing it. Which is pretty on-point for them.  |
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Post by Zenopus on Aug 24, 2023 14:18:40 GMT -6
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Post by jeffb on Aug 24, 2023 14:27:38 GMT -6
Yeah, that puzzles me too. Over the parallel DF thread, @tfoster mentioned that the $39.95 is the original MSRP. It looks to me that in the email they simply cut-and-pasted some of their old ad copy without proofing it. Which is pretty on-point for them. It is. Trolls will be Trolls. For some reason though I thought it was 29.99 bitd- maybe I just bought it at a discount. I sold it later along with the other CZ materials. Hope they all get reprinted and new ones to boot. |
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Post by Zenopus on Aug 24, 2023 14:45:04 GMT -6
I just checked and my hardcopy published in 2005 has an MSRP of $39.95 on the barcode on the back. But there's also a $20 price tag on it. And I actually bought it from an online shop for less than that in 2009. It was basically considered abandonware for years once the TLG lost the license to continue publishing the Zagyg series.
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Post by mgtremaine on Aug 24, 2023 14:50:10 GMT -6
29.99 sounds familiar but you made me search my email.... Item Name: Crusader Subscription & CZ Yggsburg Xmas Sale Quantity: 1 Total: $26.50 USD  Love those guys. -Mike |
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Post by jeffb on Aug 24, 2023 18:06:10 GMT -6
29.99 sounds familiar but you made me search my email.... Item Name: Crusader Subscription & CZ Yggsburg Xmas Sale Quantity: 1 Total: $26.50 USD Love those guys. -Mike Yep. That's right. I bought it during one of the 12 days of Xmas sales (when they used to call it that) |
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Post by tdenmark on Aug 24, 2023 23:53:10 GMT -6
Wow, that line would have looked fantastic with all that Jones' art. |
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Post by asaki on Aug 25, 2023 7:23:53 GMT -6
OMG :0
Time to start saving my pennies for the Castle itself.
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Post by Zenopus on Aug 25, 2023 9:11:50 GMT -6
Per TLG on FB, a PDF-only option is coming shortly to their website and DrivethruRPG. No price indicated yet.
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Post by thegreyelf on Aug 25, 2023 14:00:24 GMT -6
If anyone has any questions, I'll do my best to answer. Just tag me or quote here so I get a notification and I'll share whatever I know (and can say).
Re: the pdf-only option, I don't know where we are with that yet. I just fixed all the messed up bookmarks in the PDF this morning and sent them to Steve (the age of the original files wreaked havoc with the settings in modern software).
Re: the pricing - yes, that was exactly it. It was a copy/paste error showing the original MSRP. The current price is $65 for the hardcover/PDF combo. Inflation is a...well, you know.
Here's what we can say so far:
We got the license back to publish Yggsburgh.
In a few months we will launch a kickstarter to re-publish the Gygaxian Fantasy Series (Canting Crew, World Builder, Living Fantasy, City Builder, Cosmos Builder, Book of Names...and one other that is escaping my brain right now).
There is an estate that owns and controls all of this, and we have to keep showing them viability to continue to publish this stuff. That means that if we're going to get to finish publishing Castle Zagyg, we need to show SALES. The estate needs to see that this whole thing is viable and can help both pay estate expenses and generate profit. Basically, Steve gives them a plan for a product and based on what has come before, they approve or deny. We're also working directly with Luke Gygax on this. There are VOLUMES upon VOLUMES of unpublished works just waiting to see the light of day, but to get there...
The reason we are starting with Yggsburgh and the GFS is that they are already done and they generate instant profit for the estate. Yggsburgh is pre-selling like hotcakes, which is an outstanding sign for us, but yeah, get out there, spread the word, and back the effort when and where you can.
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Post by thegreyelf on Aug 25, 2023 14:08:55 GMT -6
Yes and no. Jones was not set to be the sole artist all the way through. She did cover art for the entire Castle Zagyg series - art which Steve still has - but since she has passed away and the art was never paid for (it was slated to be paid for project-by-project) we cannot CURRENTLY use it. The possibility is there, IF Steve and Luke can get hold of her estate and work something out. But that's a very big "IF" right now. |
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Post by scottenkainen on Aug 25, 2023 18:54:18 GMT -6
Ugh, the first things out of the gate are the things I already have!
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Post by DungeonDevil on Aug 25, 2023 21:32:39 GMT -6
Sounds tantalising, but I know nothing of the Castles and Crusades game. Is it an OS clone or something? Is it modelled on 0E, 1E, B/X....?
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Post by Desparil on Aug 26, 2023 0:14:27 GMT -6
Sounds tantalising, but I know nothing of the Castles and Crusades game. Is it an OS clone or something? Is it modelled on 0E, 1E, B/X....? It primarily takes after AD&D, but ability scores follow the B/X model. It doesn't seek to be a pure reproduction, though, making changes such as using ascending armor class and significantly rewriting the barbarian, bard, and knight (cavalier) classes. It also eliminates most percentile rolls in favor of d20 rolls against DM-assigned difficulties, as seen in modern D&D. So instead of having a table with a thief's chance to succeed at each skill for each character level, and then having the DM assign a bonus or penalty based on circumstances, it's a d20 roll + thief level + ability score modifier seeking to equal or exceed a target number that the DM sets. On the monster side, here's an example entry: APE, GREAT NO. ENCOUNTERED: 1–20 SIZE: Medium HD: 3 (d8) MOVE: 30 ft., 30 ft. (climb) AC: 14 ATTACKS: 2 Claw (1d3), Bite (1d6) SPECIAL: Rend, Twilight Vision SAVES: P INT: Animal ALIGNMENT: Neutral TYPE: Animal TREASURE: Nil XP: 30+3/hp |
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phantomtim
Level 3 Conjurer
13th Age Enthusiast
Posts: 85 
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Post by phantomtim on Aug 26, 2023 3:43:01 GMT -6
if we're going to get to finish publishing Castle Zagyg, we need to show SALES. The estate needs to see that this whole thing is viable and can help both pay estate expenses and generate profit. Basically, Steve gives them a plan for a product and based on what has come before, they approve or deny. We're also working directly with Luke Gygax on this. There are VOLUMES upon VOLUMES of unpublished works just waiting to see the light of day, but to get there... The reason we are starting with Yggsburgh and the GFS is that they are already done and they generate instant profit for the estate. Yggsburgh is pre-selling like hotcakes, which is an outstanding sign for us, but yeah, get out there, spread the word, and back the effort when and where you can. Good to know. I'm spreading the word in my circles. |
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Post by Finarvyn on Aug 26, 2023 4:28:22 GMT -6
Certainly, this is a project long overdue for completion. If I remember correctly, Jeffrey Talanian was the primary person working with Gary and he had gotten a lot of this line ready before Gary's estate pulled the plug. Hopefully that means that they can roll out products quickly if sales go well. Sounds like Jason thegreyelf has a big part in this project as well. That is always a good sign for quality! |
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Post by jeffb on Aug 26, 2023 7:33:01 GMT -6
Sounds tantalising, but I know nothing of the Castles and Crusades game. Is it an OS clone or something? Is it modelled on 0E, 1E, B/X....? It is Ad&D seen through the eyes of the d20 system. It has its own unique core mechanic. The PHB pdf for c&c is free. With that and any TSR or OSR book/s of monsters and treasures you can run the game for years. You can find it on the TLG site and possibly on their drive-thru page. |
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Post by asaki on Aug 26, 2023 10:27:12 GMT -6
Sounds tantalising, but I know nothing of the Castles and Crusades game. Is it an OS clone or something? Is it modelled on 0E, 1E, B/X....? I haven't poured over the mechanics, but from skimming through the Castle Zagyg book, it doesn't seem like it would be too terribly difficult to run in something else. I think the introduction even provides some examples? |
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Post by jeffb on Aug 26, 2023 16:37:02 GMT -6
Below is the TLG free download page, which has plenty of stuff for C&C including a quickstart (admittedly, pretty meager), and IMO the best presentation of their main setting- the After Winter's Dark gaz. The Codex never did anything for me. Downloads also includes a much better quickstart book for thegreyelf 's Amazing Adventures game. Bag of Holding And here is the link to the free PHB C&C PHB The C&C PHB has all the rules needed for play- only monsters and treasures are missing. BITD when it was new (before the M&T book came out) I simply used an AD&D Monster Manual and later the 2E Monstrous Manual to run C&C. If I needed to reference magic items I grabbed info from various TSR books- Moldvay/Cook/Marsh, AD&D 1E/2E...even 3.0. Conversion is super easy both ways- to C&C from T/OSR, or vice versa. I often do it on the fly. 3.0 as well. |
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Post by DungeonDevil on Aug 26, 2023 23:55:53 GMT -6
Thanks for the descriptions, gents! As always, very much appreciated! |
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Post by nagora on Aug 27, 2023 4:20:35 GMT -6
If anyone has any questions, I'll do my best to answer. Just tag me or quote here so I get a notification and I'll share whatever I know (and can say). Re: the pdf-only option, I don't know where we are with that yet. I just fixed all the messed up bookmarks in the PDF this morning and sent them to Steve (the age of the original files wreaked havoc with the settings in modern software). Re: the pricing - yes, that was exactly it. It was a copy/paste error showing the original MSRP. The current price is $65 for the hardcover/PDF combo. Inflation is a...well, you know. Here's what we can say so far: We got the license back to publish Yggsburgh. In a few months we will launch a kickstarter to re-publish the Gygaxian Fantasy Series (Canting Crew, World Builder, Living Fantasy, City Builder, Cosmos Builder, Book of Names...and one other that is escaping my brain right now). There is an estate that owns and controls all of this, and we have to keep showing them viability to continue to publish this stuff. That means that if we're going to get to finish publishing Castle Zagyg, we need to show SALES. The estate needs to see that this whole thing is viable and can help both pay estate expenses and generate profit. Basically, Steve gives them a plan for a product and based on what has come before, they approve or deny. We're also working directly with Luke Gygax on this. There are VOLUMES upon VOLUMES of unpublished works just waiting to see the light of day, but to get there... The reason we are starting with Yggsburgh and the GFS is that they are already done and they generate instant profit for the estate. Yggsburgh is pre-selling like hotcakes, which is an outstanding sign for us, but yeah, get out there, spread the word, and back the effort when and where you can. Well, I have the book already but I would be interested enough in a PDF, if, it had corrections to the various problems. By which I mostly mean the money conversion errors. I'd probably even buy a PDF if it came with a separate errata document. Do you know what the plans are in this direction, if any? |
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Post by Finarvyn on Aug 27, 2023 4:30:00 GMT -6
Sounds tantalising, but I know nothing of the Castles and Crusades game. Is it an OS clone or something? Is it modelled on 0E, 1E, B/X....? I haven't poured over the mechanics, but from skimming through the Castle Zagyg book, it doesn't seem like it would be too terribly difficult to run in something else. I think the introduction even provides some examples? It isn't hard to run at all. And if you don't like the SIEGE mechanic in the game, it's easy enough to substitute 5E's Advantage and the math is pretty similar. The Trolls tried hard to make C&C mostly similar to other games you've played before, only they did it before all of the other clones came out. There was a big question at the time as to how close you could get to avoid litigation, or it might have been even closer to AD&D. (OSRIC later came out to fill that role.) |
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Post by Finarvyn on Aug 27, 2023 4:37:55 GMT -6
The C&C PHB has all the rules needed for play- only monsters and treasures are missing. BITD when it was new (before the M&T book came out) I simply used an AD&D Monster Manual and later the 2E Monstrous Manual to run C&C. If I needed to reference magic items I grabbed info from various TSR books- Moldvay/Cook/Marsh, AD&D 1E/2E...even 3.0. Conversion is super easy both ways- to C&C from T/OSR, or vice versa. I often do it on the fly. 3.0 as well. This is truth. My "Fellowship of Foragers" gaming group was part of the original playtest, and still credited in today's printings. Back then all we had was the C&C PH and I would run games with either 1E or 2E Monster Manual or even my old OD&D books for monsters and such. All very much compatible. (And the CKG, Castle Keeper's Guide, didn't come out for something like five years after the Player's Handbook so we really had to "wing it" for a while there.) |
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Post by jeffb on Aug 27, 2023 6:22:29 GMT -6
I haven't poured over the mechanics, but from skimming through the Castle Zagyg book, it doesn't seem like it would be too terribly difficult to run in something else. I think the introduction even provides some examples? It isn't hard to run at all. And if you don't like the SIEGE mechanic in the game, it's easy enough to substitute 5E's Advantage... Yep. I never cared for the execution of the Primes vs Non Primes*. I tried the 15/+3 variant which was better, but that wasn't quite right either. I really liked the Barbarian's "best of" attacks in 13th Age and also Dungeon World featured "advantage/disadvantage" (best/worst of two rolls) mechanics. When the D&D NEXT playtest showed up with A/D, that sealed it for me- went to standard 15 challenge base, and Primes offered advantage on the roll- playtested it, and I've played C&C this way ever since. *Not just for the math scaling issues, but it also made no sense to me whatsoever that someone who had a 10 Strength but PRIME had essentially twice the bonus that someone with a non PRIME Strength of 18 has. I know the "in game reasoning" that TLG talks about in the books, but this makes way less sense than some of the 4E mechanics non-fans complain about. The "best of two roll" and static challenge base fixes that weirdness in C&C- PRIMES add a significant benefit, high scores contribute as they always have in D&D and other RPGs, and the scaling is better as you go to higher levels. |
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Post by thegreyelf on Aug 27, 2023 7:31:44 GMT -6
If anyone has any questions, I'll do my best to answer. Just tag me or quote here so I get a notification and I'll share whatever I know (and can say). Re: the pdf-only option, I don't know where we are with that yet. I just fixed all the messed up bookmarks in the PDF this morning and sent them to Steve (the age of the original files wreaked havoc with the settings in modern software). Re: the pricing - yes, that was exactly it. It was a copy/paste error showing the original MSRP. The current price is $65 for the hardcover/PDF combo. Inflation is a...well, you know. Here's what we can say so far: We got the license back to publish Yggsburgh. In a few months we will launch a kickstarter to re-publish the Gygaxian Fantasy Series (Canting Crew, World Builder, Living Fantasy, City Builder, Cosmos Builder, Book of Names...and one other that is escaping my brain right now). There is an estate that owns and controls all of this, and we have to keep showing them viability to continue to publish this stuff. That means that if we're going to get to finish publishing Castle Zagyg, we need to show SALES. The estate needs to see that this whole thing is viable and can help both pay estate expenses and generate profit. Basically, Steve gives them a plan for a product and based on what has come before, they approve or deny. We're also working directly with Luke Gygax on this. There are VOLUMES upon VOLUMES of unpublished works just waiting to see the light of day, but to get there... The reason we are starting with Yggsburgh and the GFS is that they are already done and they generate instant profit for the estate. Yggsburgh is pre-selling like hotcakes, which is an outstanding sign for us, but yeah, get out there, spread the word, and back the effort when and where you can. Well, I have the book already but I would be interested enough in a PDF, if, it had corrections to the various problems. By which I mostly mean the money conversion errors. I'd probably even buy a PDF if it came with a separate errata document. Do you know what the plans are in this direction, if any? FOR NOW it's a straight re-release, because we had to get moving for the estate reasons...though we DID fix the table of contents. I have been pushing Steve to fix some of the problems throughout, and I expect that will come before too long. Personally I have always disliked the XP penalty skills and would rather replace those with something a bit more SIEGE-Check-ish like the ones I did for Book of Powers and AA StarSIEGE. SOME of the issues in the past were not errors, but made their way in because Gygax didn't intend Yggsburgh to be part of Aihrde. We've discussed making it more intrisically part of our setting but no movement has been made on that front yet. Short version: Right now we're focused on getting things back into production as they sit, but as we move forward, we will likely bring everything in line with current C&C presentation (including fixing those old editing gaffes and the like). |
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Love those guys.
