evil cleric & undead

[doublejig2]

The following came up in a recent game session - What happens to undead that were under the control of an evil cleric, if the evil cleric is slain?

[tkdco2]

They'd probably act as they normally do. The only difference would be they don't have to obey the cleric's commands anymore.

[tombowings]

I would do the same.

[jeffb]

Me three.

[Parzival]

Yep. They’re evil, so they behave evilly.

But let’s play “Hmmmm….”
Rethinking, maybe it should depend on the type of undead. For example skeletons and zombies are mindless— they have no will or drive of their own. They simply follow the command of their master when created, whatever it maybe. And if that task is completed, presumably they cease to take any action at all.

Now, I think By the Book (or at least by implication) if the order is to “attack” then these mindless minions will continue to attack until nothing is present to attack. Which brings up an interesting question. Let’s assume a group of skeletons has been order to attack by an Evil Priest. Said priest takes an arrow to the throat and kacks it. The skellies will continue to attack. But what if the party steps behind a door and closes it? Do the skeletons pursue, no matter how far the party travels? (This could be unintentionally hilarious— the party, having killed the priest, decides to ignore the skells and leave. They travel faster than the skeletons. Not thinking of the skeletons at all, they continue on with their lives,, journeying and adventuring, pausing to rest and celebrate, etc… and then one day that same pack of skeletons finally catches up to the party, years later, swords swinging, with the party asking “Skeletons? From where? How did they get here?” “They walked. All the way.” :-D

But setting that aside, it seems to me there could be a situation which changes all this. If the Evil Priest gives the order “Defend me,” what happens when he’s no longer alive to be defended? Do the skellies defend his corpse? Or do they stop, with the task rendered moot? Could the party just back away, and have the skellies do nothing?

What if the EP says “Kill the cleric!”? Do the skells kill the cleric and then stop taking action? What if the cleric turns the skells, and they have to flee. When the effect wears off, do they return to their previous order, and cue the slow, relentless pursuit mentioned above?

And is such a pursuit even possible? The skells are mindless— if they can’t see their quarry, how do they know where their target is? They are mindless, so they can’t track or make inquiries. Do they just magically “know” where their target is at all times? Seems a really powerful ability for such weak foes…

Anyway, just thoughts for discussion…

[Deleted]

Would the undead even know the Evil Cleric is dead, especially if they're mindless types like zombies or skeleton warriors? To them, defending a dead body would be much the same as defending a living one, no?

edit: Thinking about it, though, that would also mean they'd continue attacking a fallen foe until told to stop because they wouldn't recognize that foe is slain, either, which seems darkly humorous. 

[Parzival]

Jun 20, 2022 16:20:17 GMT -6 @ampleframework said:

Would the undead even know the Evil Cleric is dead, especially if they're mindless types like zombies or skeleton warriors? To them, defending a dead body would be much the same as defending a living one, no?

edit: Thinking about it, though, that would also mean they'd continue attacking a fallen foe until told to stop because they wouldn't recognize that foe is slain, either, which seems darkly humorous. 

From whence comes the new expression “The Dead beating a horse.”
;-)

[tombowings]

Jun 20, 2022 16:20:17 GMT -6 @ampleframework said:

Would the undead even know the Evil Cleric is dead, especially if they're mindless types like zombies or skeleton warriors? To them, defending a dead body would be much the same as defending a living one, no?

edit: Thinking about it, though, that would also mean they'd continue attacking a fallen foe until told to stop because they wouldn't recognize that foe is slain, either, which seems darkly humorous. 

The way I see it, the anti-cleric's magic is what compels them to follow his commands. When the anti-cleric's dies, the magical compulsion fades and the undead return to their "natural" state (which probably still entails eating the party).

[doublejig2]

Jun 21, 2022 0:22:30 GMT -6 tombowings said:

Jun 20, 2022 16:20:17 GMT -6 @ampleframework said:

Would the undead even know the Evil Cleric is dead, especially if they're mindless types like zombies or skeleton warriors? To them, defending a dead body would be much the same as defending a living one, no?

edit: Thinking about it, though, that would also mean they'd continue attacking a fallen foe until told to stop because they wouldn't recognize that foe is slain, either, which seems darkly humorous. 

The way I see it, the anti-cleric's magic is what compels them to follow his commands. When the anti-cleric's dies, the magical compulsion fades and the undead return to their "natural" state (which probably still entails eating the party).

That's how it played out in the battle.