Rules for disabling traps, etc., without thieves

[Scott Anderson]

I just heard an old rumor (the internet is forever!) that MAR Barker had rules for performing classic thief skills if you don't have a thief. Can anyone point me in the right direction on this?

[foxroe]

You can ask @gronanofsimmerya , he may know. Otherwise I would send Chirine an email at chirine at aethervox dot net (he stopped posting here again).

[sixdemonbag]

He also posts here: www.therpgsite.com/showthread.php?36774-Questioning-chirine-ba-kal-part-II/page91

EDIT: A quick search through that thread might turn something up.

[soundchaser]

There is in the OSR legends that story of the LA group that created the thief class, alongside the furtive analysis that it was a disaster. Everyone can do the stuff the thief does. The thief, of course, is a specialist. These days I just put it at a straight 50/50 chance for non-thieves, for most stuff that isn't technical (lock picking!). The level 1 thief starts at 65% base and improves with experience.

[Zenopus]

Oct 23, 2017 22:05:23 GMT -6 soundchaser said:

There is in the OSR legends that story of the LA group that created the thief class, alongside the furtive analysis that it was a disaster. Everyone can do the stuff the thief does. The thief, of course, is a specialist. These days I just put it at a straight 50/50 chance for non-thieves, for most stuff that isn't technical (lock picking!). The level 1 thief starts at 65% base and improves with experience.

For reference, here's discussion of the original thief class created by Daniel Wagner & the crew at Aero Hobbies.

odd74.proboards.com/post/127993

This post is by Wagner himself:

Yes, our Thief class had skills on what was basically the wizard chart for spells. So, at first level you could "Pick lock" etc. I'd say more Caltech took our version whole cloth.

Our original likely looked a lot like the Caltech version.

Gygax and team did the %, not us.

The Caltech version was published as Warlock and later Complete Warlock.

[Baron]

A few comments:

There is no "Thief" in Barker's Empire of the Petal Throne. And there are no "Thieves" as a role in Barker's society of Tekumel; at least not as a D&D player would think of the role. In fact, Barker made thieving not only taboo, but basically the punishment for any infraction was death by impalement. It's been awhile, but as I recall the only other game system that Barker wrote himself, Swords and Glory, doesn't allow for the role of "Thief" either. There is a clan suspected of robbing tombs, but that would be despicable. So, I doubt there are any particular thieving rules assembled by Barker, who at his own table usually hand-waved tasks with a simple "roll dice, high is good, low is bad." But from what I've heard, to disarm traps etc at his table, you just described what you wanted to do, as in most pre-Thief class games.

Aero Hobbies is my local game store! They proudly announce "Home of the Thief" on their website.

I used to have The Complete Warlock. I don't remember any thieving material in there, only lots of spells, but it's been decades since I lost my copy. I didn't recall that it was an outgrowth of Cal Tech, but that's pretty cool.

[geoffrey]

Oct 24, 2017 0:05:10 GMT -6 Baron said:

There is no "Thief" in Barker's Empire of the Petal Throne. And there are no "Thieves" as a role in Barker's society of Tekumel; at least not as a D&D player would think of the role. In fact, Barker made thieving not only taboo, but basically the punishment for any infraction was death by impalement.

Yep. There are assassins on Tekumel, but not thieves. Assassination can be "noble", but not thievery.