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Post by Falconer on Jun 1, 2015 11:01:12 GMT -6
Going by what is said on-screen in the original movie, here is some “purist” nomenclature which might help reinforce an old school feel:
Imperial Cruiser (not Star Destroyer)
Sandpeople (not Tusken Raiders)
Governor Tarkin (not Grand Moff Tarkin)
Commander [Tagge] (not General Tagge)
Work in progress… Not saying anyone should necessarily ditch the parenthetical versions, which were present in the script (just never spoken aloud).
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Post by geoffrey on Jun 1, 2015 12:06:57 GMT -6
Excellent thread.
Governor Tarkin (not Grand Moff Tarkin)
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Post by desertscrb on Dec 6, 2015 23:18:23 GMT -6
In the original movie, did the characters ever refer to X-wings and Y-wings by that nomenclature? I just remember the characters calling them "snub fighters" or "ships".
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Post by Deleted on Dec 7, 2015 10:50:51 GMT -6
In the original movie, did the characters ever refer to X-wings and Y-wings by that nomenclature? Not in the dialog but those terms, along with TIE Fighter and Stardestroyer, are used in the script. And, yes, it's "Stardestroyer" not "Star Destroyer". The only nomenclature mentioned by name are the XP-38 (a landspeeder), T-16 (Luke's skyhopper), and the "Incom T-65" in a line cut from the movie. |
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Post by Starbeard on Dec 31, 2015 13:44:36 GMT -6
I've been going through this recently myself. There are 3 levels of nomenclature for Star Wars, really:
1. What's given in the movie
2. What's published in the materials that surrounded the movie (including the public script, the Poster Monthly, comics, etc.)
3. What's in the unpublished source material (draft scripts, personal notes, cut scenes, etc.)
At the first level, there really isn't much technical jargon at all. Hedge's correct about the XP-38, T-16 and T-65 references being the only technical ones in the dialogue. In the scripts we also get TIE Fighter, Stardestroyer, Tusken Raider, 'Grand Moff' Tarkin, X-Wing, Rebel Blockade Runner. Y-Wing isn't in the script, but shows up in all the promotional material.
The 1977 Star Wars Blueprints book has a bunch of technical names for some of the landspeeders, like the Mobquet landspeeder, the Void-Spider Land-speeder TX-3, and the Ubrikkian Landspeeder 9000 Z001.
Over the past 15 months or so I've been thinking about throwing together a Star Wars game, either in person or online, using the core Traveller rules and sticking basically to pre-Empire source material. I'm still undecided about where I'd draw the line on which level of 'canonicity' to enforce. Part of me likes the idea of going only with the terms and technologies that are shown in the movie, but I also think it would reinforce the old school feel to dig into some of the abandoned stuff from the draft scripts, like making 'laser swords' something of a fairly normal weapon, but which the Jedi favoured in particular. Also, making use of the promotional merchandise could help, such as descriptions that describe the X-Wing as a run down, obsolete aircraft, the Y-Wing as the sleek 'ultra-hotrodded' attack ship of the Alliance, and the TIE Fighter as being superior in its technology to both of them.
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Post by Finarvyn on Dec 31, 2015 14:52:48 GMT -6
Over the past 15 months or so I've been thinking about throwing together a Star Wars game, either in person or online, using the core Traveller rules and sticking basically to pre-Empire source material. You've probably seen this already, but we have a thread that lists off the novels which were published "back in the day" if you want to use that as source material in addition to other sources you mentioned. I totally forgot about the Star Wars blueprints. I have a set of those somewhere... |
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Post by Falconer on Dec 31, 2015 15:30:13 GMT -6
These are the planets mentioned in the movie: Tatooine, Alderaan, Yavin, Kessel, Corellia, and Dantooine.
Only the first three are shown. Kessel and Corellia are not necessarily planets.
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Post by Starbeard on Jan 1, 2016 6:00:40 GMT -6
Some more terms from the on-screen dialogue of the theatrical release, plus a few deleted scenes where appropriate. One thing to note is that if you're going to include deleted scene dialogue, you might as well include action descriptions in the script as well, so things like X-Wings and Star Destroyers become usable terms again.
Politics & Entities
Empire: Galactic Empire, Empire, Imperial
Rebellion: Rebel Alliance, Rebellion, Rebel (note: 'The Alliance' is used only in a deleted scene from the public script)
Imperial Senate: increasingly entertains rebel sympathies, until the Emperor dissolves it for good. Presumably Vader’s attack against a ‘diplomatic mission’ is illegal and would have stirred the Senate into action.
Old Republic & Jedi Knights
The Academy: somewhere not on Tatooine (in a deleted scene, Biggs went there for a year and is now first mate on a frigate, the Rand Ecliptic).
Places and creatures on Tatooine
Jundland Wastes: where Luke meets Ben.
Toshi Station: where Luke wanted to go pick up power converters.
Anchorhead: where Luke was supposed to have Artoo's memory wiped.
Mos Eisley Spaceport: lies beyond Anchorhead.
Sandpeople/Sand People and their gaffi sticks: In public script deleted scene, the sandpeople have started raiding as far as the outskirts of Anchorhead.
Banthas
Jawas
Planets (from public script dialogue only)
Central Systems: the Empire is starting to nationalize commerce there. Biggs thinks it won't be long before farmers like Owen will become mere tenants, slaves to the Empire.
Bestine: a planet in or near the central systems, where Biggs hopes to join the Rebellion through a friend of a friend.
Imperial Spaceships
Imperial starships/cruisers: includes local bulk-cruisers (slow), and big Corellian ships (fast).
Imperial fighter
'Droids
Artoo is an astro-droid. He can sense creatures approaching from a general direction.
Threepio is a human-cyborg relations droid. His primary programming is in protocol (and as an interpreter), but has over 30 secondary functions, including programming binary languages.
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Post by Starbeard on Jan 1, 2016 6:02:52 GMT -6
Over the past 15 months or so I've been thinking about throwing together a Star Wars game, either in person or online, using the core Traveller rules and sticking basically to pre-Empire source material. You've probably seen this already, but we have a thread that lists off the novels which were published "back in the day" if you want to use that as source material in addition to other sources you mentioned. I totally forgot about the Star Wars blueprints. I have a set of those somewhere... Thanks for the thread link, Fin! I've been trying to re-read those in between other books on my list. I've got a couple of thoughts so far I'll add to that thread. |
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Post by Falconer on Jan 1, 2016 11:03:31 GMT -6
Great stuff, Starbeard!
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Post by Falconer on Jan 1, 2016 14:03:24 GMT -6
Okay, here was a fun little project. None of these canina aliens were named in the movie, but they all had production nicknames: Awesome, right? Wouldn’t you love to blast martians and devils and wolfmen and rodents so much more than a Shistavanen or a H’nemthe or any of that EU crap? One thing I would take from the early Marvel comics is to use the Walrus (not to be confused with Walrus Man) and call him a Hut. I love that. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 1, 2016 14:42:57 GMT -6
The radio drama calls this a Merian Hammerhead. |
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Post by Falconer on Jan 1, 2016 15:12:39 GMT -6
The radio drama is from 1981 (i.e., after even ESB), and gave names to many things. I think it named the Tantive IV (just Rebel Blockade Runner in the script). I’m not against any of its nomenclature per se, but it is surely well outside the scope of this thread.
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Post by geoffrey on Jan 1, 2016 17:20:57 GMT -6
Also, making use of the promotional merchandise could help, such as descriptions that describe the X-Wing as a run down, obsolete aircraft, the Y-Wing as the sleek 'ultra-hotrodded' attack ship of the Alliance, and the TIE Fighter as being superior in its technology to both of them. The descriptions of the Y-wings and X-wings seem backwards to me. The old hands of the Rebellion flew the Y-wings. The young hotshots flew the X-wings. I would think that the older guys would prefer the older ships. |
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Post by geoffrey on Jan 1, 2016 17:22:09 GMT -6
Awesome aliens, Falconer. I never noticed some of them, especially that praying mantis one. I'm going to have to find all those guys in the movie.
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Post by desertscrb on Jan 1, 2016 18:10:19 GMT -6
One thing I would take from the early Marvel comics is to use the Walrus (not to be confused with Walrus Man) and call him a Hut. I love that. Right, it was interesting how the Marvel movie adaptation used that depiction of Jabba the Hutt in a scene left out of the theatrical release:  |
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Post by Falconer on Jan 1, 2016 20:50:25 GMT -6
Check out his Snaggletooth and Hare Mouse henchmen.  “Jabba the Hut” reappears in a few later issues of the comic book. Don’t get me wrong, the giant slug Sydney Greenstreet of RotJ is inspired, but, this guy has much more recurring villain power, since he’s able to personally fly around the galaxy in his Voidraker to hunt you down himself when all the bounty hunters have failed. |
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Post by Starbeard on Jan 2, 2016 8:47:46 GMT -6
Those are awesome, Falconer! I agree about ditching the EU names and sticking to the production nicknames.
I do find the Phil Tippett slug-Jabba pretty inspired, but running Star Wars I think I would always use Walrus Jabba, or maybe split the difference and pick one of the other humanoid descriptions from the draft scripts. I also like the idea of a Hut being the term for any powerful galactic crime lord, rather than a single species of godfathers. Every Hut the players faced would be unique.
I think there are three essential aspects in giving aliens a classic feel: 1) only provide official species names to central alien characters (wookies) or aliens who are encountered as an entire race (jawas)—for the rest, just describe them; 2) aliens never speak English if it can be helped—instead, have them make bizarre sounds and gesticulate wildly, then relate what they're saying in summary (if the party can understand—in the first movie Luke spends most of the time not understanding Artoo, the cantina aliens, or Chewie, but he does understand the jawas); and 3) reusing the same alien species is okay, but the galaxy is big—put a lot of effort into introducing unique aliens for an encounter and then discard them, especially in cosmopolitan areas.
I can imagine an encounter like this, and it feels so much more like Star Wars to me than trying to throw in EU verisimilitudes: 'As you turn the corner into the small plaza where used goods are traded, you spy a hulking alien in the corner—some mothlike being whose head reminds you uncomfortably of a shark turned inside out. The mothshark appears to have just bought the last battered speeder in the lot, from a hunchbacked and snaggletoothed humanoid who quickly scurries away, cloak-and-dagger.'
[And short while later…] 'Mothshark jabs a bristly grey finger at the speeder and barks at you angrily, its grotesque wail sounding not unlike a shrieking dolphin spun backwards. After a terrifying moment you realize that he's just talking. Now that he's bought the speeder, he seems to be offering it to you at a slightly higher price.'
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Post by Starbeard on Jan 2, 2016 8:56:30 GMT -6
Also, making use of the promotional merchandise could help, such as descriptions that describe the X-Wing as a run down, obsolete aircraft, the Y-Wing as the sleek 'ultra-hotrodded' attack ship of the Alliance, and the TIE Fighter as being superior in its technology to both of them. The descriptions of the Y-wings and X-wings seem backwards to me. The old hands of the Rebellion flew the Y-wings. The young hotshots flew the X-wings. I would think that the older guys would prefer the older ships. They do to me as well, but I think that's why I like them. Maybe the way we think of those scenes now was always the case, but at the same time it could be the result of several decades of reception that has made it difficult for us to see the original scenes as anything but 'young hot-shots in X-Wings and slow old-timers in Y-Wings', since we already know what X-Wings and Y-Wings should be like. It could also be that the old-timers are the hot-shots, because they're the few veteran aces the Rebellion has, and so get the pick of their best stuff. The Y-Wings are, after all, the ones who are assigned to take the trench run first—it wouldn't make as much sense for the general's battle briefing to state that their greatest concern is hitting the trench at top speeds, and then go on to send in the lumbering craft. The young guys like Biggs & Wedge are brand newbies and are assigned the more expendable gear. Luke's never even flown a spaceship before, and so they're not going to give him one of their prize fighters if there's anyone with better cred to do the job. Of course, I understand that's looking for realism where there is none. Throughout several of the draft scripts it was already established that the movie climax would have the young hero hop in a ship and 'learn how to fly' on the way to the Death Star, where he discovers that he's the best pilot in the galaxy and saves the day by being the one who can blow up the station. Still, it's an interesting thought, and opens up a whole new way of looking at the story and the intention of the visuals. When you think about the design concept of the Y-Wing itself—two giant rocket engines attached to a tiny cockpit pod, chassis completely stripped off and exposing the wires to make it as light-weight as possible—it does sort of look like a mean dragster. |
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Post by Starbeard on Jan 3, 2016 5:03:27 GMT -6
More Tatooine locations from the movie: Ben lives out beyond the Dune Sea, and Luke flew Beggar's Canyon back home.
Death Star is mentioned as 'the Death Star' in the opening text crawl, the Imperial commander at the beginning says he can't find 'the Death Star plans', and at the hidden Rebel base someone says over the PA, 'Death Star approaching'. It's otherwise known as a space station or 'the battle station'. Whole heaps of the promotional material, including the official magazines, preferred to call it simply 'Death Star' rather than 'the Death Star'. As in, 'the heroes went to Death Star and barely made it out alive.'
There is only 'the Force', and 'the dark side of the Force'. Lord Darth Vader is only 'Dark Lord of the Sith' in the script cues, not in any dialogue.
Chewbacca's home of Kashyyyk is never mentioned in movie or script. The Holiday Special names the wookiee homeworld (first instance?), but it's actually called 'Kazzook' there. Maybe half a year later in 1979, the Russ Manning comics for LA times and the Marvel comics both called it 'Kazhyyyk' or 'Kazhyyk'.
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Post by geoffrey on Jan 5, 2016 22:09:22 GMT -6
Speaking of Jabba, that's all he's called in the 1977 Star Wars film: Jabba. No "the Hut/t" after his name. Plain, simple Jabba.
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Post by Starbeard on Jan 25, 2016 12:32:16 GMT -6
Anybody know what the various droid props were called back then? The Kenner toys had the Power Droid, Death Star Droid and R5-D4 (Arfive-Deefor?). The production team must have had their own nicknames for the others, though.
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Post by Zenopus on Jan 25, 2016 13:48:12 GMT -6
FWIW, the Kenner silver "Death Star Droid" (which I had as a kid) is actually shown in the Jawa Sandcrawler. The one on the death star is painted black. See here. |
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Post by Zenopus on Jan 26, 2016 22:08:51 GMT -6
How about a "Kennerverse" for toys by Kenner that weren't in the movies? For pre-Empire Strikes Back, there's the Kenner Droid Factory (1979). This was the first Star Wars set that I owned, probably because my parents thought it was more educational than the others. Together, my sister and I had this set, plus Luke, Leia, R2 and Threepio. What's missing? A villain! So naturally one of the robots in the set ( Mechano Droid) became my villain until I was able to get a Vader. The rest of the set is long gone, but I still have Mechano Droid with my surviving figures. In addition to Mechano Droid, the set had instructions for building R2-D2 (with third leg), Tracto-Droid, Quad-Pod Droid, Rollarc Droid and Monster Droid, plus a bunch of other unnamed combinations. Attachments:
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Post by Starbeard on Jan 27, 2016 8:31:46 GMT -6
Very cool. For non-movie stuff, the pre-Empire Kenner toy line also had the Imperial Troop Transport, which also came with its own little illustrated storybook with lots of Kenner toy product placements ( link here, scroll down to 'KENNER TOYS: IMPERIAL TROOP TRANSPORT COMIC'). The storybook has a pretty good description of the vehicle, except for their literal interpretation of the silly 'troops strapped to the outside' thing. Speaking of which, the toy also showed up in the Marvel comics in the Way of the Wookiee and Return to Tatooine issues, obviously used to market the toy's release:   It's funny how depictions of the toy slavishly copied it's actual toy appearance, right down to carrying the stormtroopers in those silly buckets on the outside. They even tried explaining it away for continuity (their stormtrooper armor makes it almost impossible to sit, so this is the only way they can board a transport). As a kid I just assumed that the transport 'seats' were just figurative; I mean, every toy line between 75-98 had some themed way of carrying your toys around, and they all looked goofy. I figured that the 'real' transporter would obviously have the stormtroopers on the inside. For what it's worth, the vehicle also has non-Kenner precedence: a conspicuously similar transporter is written into Splinter of the Mind's Eye, and even before that several of the movie's draft scripts featured scenes with 'hover tanks' that were also very close in description (the Endor scenes later rehashed some of that material without hovertanks, and the Naboo scenes rehashed other scenes and kept them). |
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Post by coffee on Jan 27, 2016 8:40:16 GMT -6
Anybody know what the various droid props were called back then? The Kenner toys had the Power Droid, Death Star Droid and R5-D4 (Arfive-Deefor?). The production team must have had their own nicknames for the others, though. R5-D4 always bothered me. He's the one Owen originally buys from the Jawas, but he pops his top before he can get very far. And then Luke says: "Uncle Owen! This R2 unit has a bad motivator! Look!" So he should have been another R2 something (although with a different dome, so not a D2 model). Or maybe Luke was just wrong. But I prefer my interpretation. |
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Post by Zenopus on Jan 27, 2016 23:51:52 GMT -6
Very cool. For non-movie stuff, the pre-Empire Kenner toy line also had the Imperial Troop Transport, which also came with its own little illustrated storybook with lots of Kenner toy product placements ( link here, scroll down to 'KENNER TOYS: IMPERIAL TROOP TRANSPORT COMIC'). The storybook has a pretty good description of the vehicle, except for their literal interpretation of the silly 'troops strapped to the outside' thing. For a toy tie-in, that's a particularly grim little comic! |
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Post by desertscrb on Jan 31, 2016 16:07:44 GMT -6
Very cool. For non-movie stuff, the pre-Empire Kenner toy line also had the Imperial Troop Transport, which also came with its own little illustrated storybook with lots of Kenner toy product placements ( link here, scroll down to 'KENNER TOYS: IMPERIAL TROOP TRANSPORT COMIC'). The storybook has a pretty good description of the vehicle, except for their literal interpretation of the silly 'troops strapped to the outside' thing. Speaking of which, the toy also showed up in the Marvel comics in the Way of the Wookiee and Return to Tatooine issues, obviously used to market the toy's release: View Attachment View AttachmentIt's funny how depictions of the toy slavishly copied it's actual toy appearance, right down to carrying the stormtroopers in those silly buckets on the outside. They even tried explaining it away for continuity (their stormtrooper armor makes it almost impossible to sit, so this is the only way they can board a transport). As a kid I just assumed that the transport 'seats' were just figurative; I mean, every toy line between 75-98 had some themed way of carrying your toys around, and they all looked goofy. I figured that the 'real' transporter would obviously have the stormtroopers on the inside. For what it's worth, the vehicle also has non-Kenner precedence: a conspicuously similar transporter is written into Splinter of the Mind's Eye, and even before that several of the movie's draft scripts featured scenes with 'hover tanks' that were also very close in description (the Endor scenes later rehashed some of that material without hovertanks, and the Naboo scenes rehashed other scenes and kept them). That imperial troop transport makes an appearance in season 1 of Star Wars Rebels on Disney's XD channel, and I think they used the outside buckets to hold prisoners. I got a kick out of that. |
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Post by Falconer on Feb 22, 2016 18:48:16 GMT -6
From the wiki:
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Post by geoffrey on Mar 8, 2016 12:48:22 GMT -6
How about a "Kennerverse" for toys by Kenner that weren't in the movies? For pre-Empire Strikes Back, there's the Kenner Droid Factory (1979). This was the first Star Wars set that I owned, probably because my parents thought it was more educational than the others. Together, my sister and I had this set, plus Luke, Leia, R2 and Threepio. What's missing? A villain! So naturally one of the robots in the set ( Mechano Droid) became my villain until I was able to get a Vader. The rest of the set is long gone, but I still have Mechano Droid with my surviving figures. In addition to Mechano Droid, the set had instructions for building R2-D2 (with third leg), Tracto-Droid, Quad-Pod Droid, Rollarc Droid and Monster Droid, plus a bunch of other unnamed combinations. That's awesome.  |
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