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Post by Zenopus on Aug 22, 2021 15:13:28 GMT -6
I've updated my blog post with some info on where the show will later travel to:
---May 20 to September 5, 2022: Hunter Museum of American Art in Chattanooga, TN
---September 23, 2022 to January 8, 2023: Flint Institute of Art in Flint, MI
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Post by Zenopus on Aug 20, 2021 8:48:12 GMT -6
This was post was in this thread, but I decided to move it to its own thread on the General Board, as the goal is to make people aware of the show in case they would like to visit while it is running. * * * * * David Sutherland's iconic painting for Holmes Basic is on exhibit for the first time at the Norman Rockwell Museum in MA! I visited two weeks ago, below is my best photo of it. I've also written a blog post for the Zenopus Archives about my visit: zenopusarchives.blogspot.com/2021/08/the-holmes-basic-set-cover-art-exhibited.html
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Post by Zenopus on Aug 7, 2021 7:16:41 GMT -6
I see the buttons on the bottom on mobile view (Chrome/Android), but not on desktop view on the same device.
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Post by Zenopus on Jul 27, 2021 9:00:10 GMT -6
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Post by Zenopus on Jul 26, 2021 10:27:01 GMT -6
waysoftheearth, I think retrorob may be referring to what I posted upthread a few days ago about WoM having an explicit 1:1 scale with 10 sec turns comprising 2 rounds of combat: One item I'll post in support of the Donjon Lands argument is that Warriors of Mars, which includes systems clearly derived from Chainmail, has two separate scales that "are not mixed on the table": 1:50, in which "1 turn = 1 min" and "1" = 10 yards" 1:1, in which "1 turn = 10 sec" and "1" = 6 feet" The 1:1 scale is described on pages 16-17 and appears modified from Chainmail MTM, and "has two rounds of melee each turn", thus rounds are 5 sec each. Now, whether this type of split scale was ever used with Chainmail Mass Combat/MTM is up to interpretation, but it almost appears to be written in recognition of the ambiguity of Chainmail.
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Post by Zenopus on Jul 25, 2021 16:04:03 GMT -6
The question is, why is it *more likely* that Gygax intended 6 second rounds in OD&D (10 rounds/per 1 minute "combat turn"), than one minute rounds, with 10 equaling a ten-minute turn?
*We've got Chainmail saying that "One turn of play is roughly equivalent to one minute of time in battle", and Gygax's 1975 letter upthread, indicating but a single melee round per turn in Chainmail.
*We've got OD&D adding "Two moves constitute a turn" and "There are ten rounds of combat per turn", with no other stated distinction between turns.
*We've got Gygax saying in 1978 that the 1 minute melee round in OD&D was what was intended:
(Dragon #15, June 1978, "From the Sorcerer's Scroll: D&D GROUND AND SPELL AREA SCALE")
*We've got Gygax keeping the 1-minute round in AD&D, and defending it.
It's pretty easy from the above to draw a straight line from the Chainmail 1-minute turn through OD&D to the AD&D 1-minute round. It's possible to argue that shorter rounds were intended in OD&D Vol 3, but I think it requires a heavier burden to overcome the above than has been put forth so far. And it's harder now that there's evidence indicating that the Chainmail turn was not, by default, meant to include multiple rounds of combat.
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Post by Zenopus on Jul 24, 2021 14:52:06 GMT -6
~2 hours left. I was on the fence about it since I already have a nice copy of the hardcover 3rd edition, which includes the rulebook, 20s sourcebook and Companion all together. I mostly wanted the adventures, but wasn't sure about pdf or print. Then I read that the 2" size was chosen to replicate the size of the original 1981 box. Holmes reviewed the 1st edition back in 1983 for Gameplay magazine*, so the connection there was enough to put me over into the print column. * This review was reprinted in a zine in 2019, along with artwork by Chris Holmes: zenopusarchives.blogspot.com/2019/09/holmes-1983-review-of-call-of-cthulhu.html
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Post by Zenopus on Jul 24, 2021 14:08:50 GMT -6
ThrorIIThanks for your comment. Whether or not "Chainmail has an unlimited number of melee rounds in a 1-minute combat turn" is actually what this entire thread is about! I replied to you on Grognardia. Here's part of what I wrote: See the referenced article in my post upthread.
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Post by Zenopus on Jul 24, 2021 12:30:11 GMT -6
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Post by Zenopus on Jul 24, 2021 12:28:51 GMT -6
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Post by Zenopus on Jul 24, 2021 10:11:58 GMT -6
One item I'll post in support of the Donjon Lands argument is that Warriors of Mars, which includes systems clearly derived from Chainmail, has two separate scales that "are not mixed on the table":
1:50, in which "1 turn = 1 min" and "1" = 10 yards" 1:1, in which "1 turn = 10 sec" and "1" = 6 feet"
The 1:1 scale is described on pages 16-17 and appears modified from Chainmail MTM, and "has two rounds of melee each turn", thus rounds are 5 sec each.
Now, whether this type of split scale was ever used with Chainmail Mass Combat/MTM is up to interpretation, but it almost appears to be written in recognition of the ambiguity of Chainmail.
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Post by Zenopus on Jul 24, 2021 10:07:24 GMT -6
There is a new blog post over on DONJON LANDS that cites this thread as part of an argument that D&D rounds are meant to be less than one minute long. The thrust of the argument, which I am not sold on, is that Chainmail's Man-to-Man combat sequence *must* occur at a shorter scale than the 1 minute rounds of Mass Combat. www.donjonlands.com/2021/07/chainmail-odd-and-the-one-minute-combat-round.htmlThere's also a post about it on Grognardia today, with further discussion. grognardia.blogspot.com/2021/07/the-one-minute-combat-round.htmlAs I wrote there: But for purposes of this thread, where we've now found contemporaneous evidence (see my post above) that the "second round" of Mass Combat occurs in the "second turn", meaning there is typically one round of combat per turn, how do you feel about the argument that Man-to-Man combat differs in that the procedures assumes multiple rounds of combat per turn if both combatants survive the first round? The argument over there is long, so I won't repeat it all here, but a lot of hit hinges on the interpretation that the instructions for "2nd Round and thereafter" in Man-to-Man only makes sense if the rounds are all occurring in a single turn. Which, to me, remains debatable.
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Post by Zenopus on Jul 24, 2021 9:06:18 GMT -6
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Post by Zenopus on Jul 22, 2021 22:16:37 GMT -6
Thanks for the heads up! From the preview, it's a 3rd Edition (1975), 7th printing (April 1979), and scanned from an original rather than re-typeset like the OD&D booklets.
The print plus digital version costs the same as the print version alone, $6.99. I just ordered a copy, will report on quality when it arrives. The total with tax and media mail shipping was $11.91.
I haven't owned a print copy of Chainmail in quite a while. I used to have this same edition (including the coiled rings mentioned above), which I ordered from the TSR Mail Order Hobby Shop in the late '80s, but I sold it on Ebay at some point in the late '90s.
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Post by Zenopus on Jul 12, 2021 16:23:53 GMT -6
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Post by Zenopus on Jun 24, 2021 13:45:24 GMT -6
In CM's description of Trolls (and Ogres) 2nd Ed p30, 3rd Ed p34 we have it that: <<Ogres are killed when they have taken an accumulation of six missile or melee hits in normal combat.>> The next sentence qualifies this, adding: <<Elves can kill them in three hits, and Hero-types or magical weapons kill them with a single hit.>> I can confirm that the 1st printing of Chainmail also has all of the above text, on page 41. I don't have a full copy of the 1st printing, just some auction images, but this is one of the pages that I do have an image of.
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Post by Zenopus on Jun 7, 2021 19:52:13 GMT -6
Welcome, @sonofbear!
Bumping an old thread is fine here. In fact, I will sometimes merge a new thread with an older one that covers the same topic.
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Post by Zenopus on Jun 5, 2021 9:30:08 GMT -6
My current ranking from 10 (best) to 0 (worst): 10: Star Wars 9: The Empire Strikes Back 8: Return of the Jedi 7: Rogue One 6: The Rise of Skywalker 5: The Force Awakens 4: Solo 3: The Last Jedi 2: Revenge of the Sith 1: Attack of the Clones 0: The Phantom Menace My rankings are pretty close to these, though I would place Rogue One lower and Solo higher. Rewatching Episodes 1-9 with the kids last year, and all in order for myself for the first time ever, reinforced my views. Original Trilogy > Sequel Trilogy >>>>> Prequel Trilogy. I just don't enjoy much of the Prequel Trilogy, while I find the Sequel Trilogy entertaining, with the chemistry between the leads much closer to the original trilogy, which goes a long way.
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Post by Zenopus on Jun 5, 2021 9:26:58 GMT -6
aramisBold choices, placing TFA and Mandalorian below the Holiday Special! 
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Post by Zenopus on Jun 3, 2021 12:59:19 GMT -6
badger2305Awesome, I've played in several games with Steve in the past, both at NTX and Gary Con, and have always enjoyed it. I am participating in a few virtual NTRPGCon games. These have not been very well advertised, but there are 21 of them, including some Tim Kask OD&D games. The schedule is here: tabletop.events/conventions/ntrpgcon-2021v-virtual-Badges are $2 for a day, or $5 for the weekend, a bargain compared to virtual Gary Con. Tonight I'm playing a Tekumel game (Bethorm version), run by Manda, Jeff Dee's wife (Jeff is the Bethorm author). There's one seat left in it if anyone here is interested: tabletop.events/conventions/ntrpgcon-2021v-virtual-/schedule/4A friend of mine is running a MERP game, "Wight Gold", tomorrow night that could use more players: tabletop.events/conventions/ntrpgcon-2021v-virtual-/schedule/21(I playtested it or I would join) I'm also playing in a Holmes game run by DM Perky on Sunday, but that one is full.
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Post by Zenopus on Jun 3, 2021 12:52:01 GMT -6
Sure, but that meme makes out like the "reluctant mentor" is this outlandish idea that only Johnson would use, when in fact it's such a common trope that it was used in the Karate Kid series itself.
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Post by Zenopus on Jun 2, 2021 17:02:42 GMT -6
Well, Mr Miyagi did refuse to train Daniel in Karate Kid III...
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Post by Zenopus on May 26, 2021 11:37:55 GMT -6
I used some pictures online to make this pdf of The Character Archaic (1975, 1st printing). It's fuzzy but can be read for the most part: I appreciate your enthusiasm, but we should refrain from posting Wee Warriors material here. The intellectual property was acquired by Precis Intermedia a few years ago, and they sell digital copies now: www.pigames.net/store/default.php?cPath=145"Wee Warriors, Palace of the Vampire Queen, The Dwarven Glory, The Misty Isles, The Embattled Trek, Labyrinthine, The Vanquished Foe, Dogtags, Dragonlord, The Character Archaic, The Endless Dungeon, The Village, and Dungeon Designer's Kit are game and game accessory trademarks of Precis Intermedia. All rights reserved." They don't offer the Character Archaic per se for sale, but do have a free pdf download of a remastered version of the character sheet from it here: www.pigames.net/store/articles.php?page=537
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Post by Zenopus on May 24, 2021 6:48:09 GMT -6
@ampleframework I also thought of Black Puddings when I read At the Mountains of Madness, enough that I used them in the write-up for the Ancient Builders (Old One/Primordial One analogs, which Vile Traveller included in Blueholme). But I didn't note that the Shoggoths could also be an inspiration for the "clean-up crew" term. The Blob is another strong contender for the Black Pudding, so we need to consider both as possible sources for the idea of the "clean-up crew". Gygax credited Arneson with the Black Pudding, but I don't know who coined "clean-up crew" term. See my speculation on the origins of the Ochre Jelly here for more discussion of this: Ochre Jelly Inspiration?Back in 2006 on DF, someone actually asked Gygax whether the Shoggoths served as inspiration for the Black Pudding. His reply, which includes a very Gygaxian pun:
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Post by Zenopus on May 21, 2021 7:55:44 GMT -6
The DR thing was definitely mentioned by Gary himself at one point, on the Troll Lord Games forum. Sadly, that's been flushed down the commode by the internet over the years. It's referenced multiple times, including an old thread here. It's a shame the original TLG forum no longer exists, of course. There's still multiple archived internet threads of Gary talking about how he ran his home games, though, notably at ENworld and DF. I know he made some comments about his white box games there a time or two but I'm not sure how much those comments apply here and there's a ton of threads to dig through to find relevant Gary quotes. (That's a good problem to have!) The Troll Lord Games forums, including Gary's original post, are still around; they've just moved in the intervening time which has resulted in broken links. Here's the current link to the post with "Gary's OD&D House Rules" from August 2007. I also put that corrected link in the older thread here that you linked above. For posterity, here's an exact quote of what Gary wrote there. I again stress that these are his 2007 rules for convention games. They aren't exactly the same as what was reported in 2005, and most certainly differ from what he used in the 1970s. As a followup to what you wrote above, I don't see anything about damage reduction here.
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Post by Zenopus on May 3, 2021 22:07:35 GMT -6
I became aware of the 1st print when I noticed the extra mythos in the copy of D&DG at my local library! I already had my own non-Cthulhu/Melnibonean copy, received in mid-1983 (IIRC), so this was probably around '84. I'm surprised it survived in the stacks for that long!
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Post by Zenopus on May 1, 2021 14:48:18 GMT -6
I had my Gen Con XIII program handy and checked it. There's a full page ad on page 17 for D&DG that screams across the top: "JUST RELEASED from TSR HOBBIES INC".
So it was definitely available at that Gen Con, which was Aug 24-26.
Depending on when they had it ready, it may have also been available at the earlier Origins, but we would need to check the program book or con reports to see if there is any evidence for that.
* * * * *
Other Gen Con XIII ads for new TSR products include the Knights of Camelot boardgame and the World of Greyhawk folio, along with WoG Fantasy Figures by Minifigs. TSR also has ads for the Dungeon Hobby Shop and Dragon Publishing, and TSR artist Darlene has her own ad for Art & Calligraphy.
Other companies/products with ads include Valiant Miniatures, Balboa Game Company, SPI, Iron Crown Enterprises, Judges Guild, The Courier magazine, Martian Metals, International Team Games, Asteroid by GDW, Titan, Ral Partha, La Bataille D'Austerlitz, TA-HR miniatures, Tom Loback General Artworks, Lyles Hobby & Craft Center, Game Room Productions, Grenadier Models and, on the back cover, "New Fantasy Aids!" by Dimension Six.
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Post by Zenopus on May 1, 2021 14:16:26 GMT -6
Yes! I did grow up in the region. Some of my favorite places to visit growing up were the DC Zoo, the Smithsonian Natural History Museum and the Baltimore Aquarium. In the later '80s, I bought my OD&D "Collector's Edition" Whitebox at a game store that used to exist in the Harborplace Mall in the Inner Harbor. That's as specific as I will be in a public forum. 
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Post by Zenopus on May 1, 2021 13:08:21 GMT -6
No firm date , sorry. It was under the Xmas tree that year for me. But I had seen it much earlier at Crown Books behind the counter  As far as I remember, the first D&D book that I ever looked through was a Monster Manual at a Crown Books! This was before I got my Holmes Basic set. I remember the Bulette on the title page - which I recognized from my sandbox toys - and the ferocious-looking Carnivorous Ape.
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Post by Zenopus on May 1, 2021 12:56:03 GMT -6
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