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Post by Finarvyn on Jun 21, 2011 8:52:46 GMT -6
Want to know why Robert E Howard rocks? I decided to re-read the Howard Conan tales and started with The Coming of Conan in the Del Ray trade paper series. The stories are published therein in the order written, as best as anyone can tell, not the order that they appeared in magazines. As such, "The Phoenix on the Sword" is the first story in the sequence. Here's how it begins: That paragraph just drips "atmosphere" to me.
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Azafuse
Level 5 Thaumaturgist
Posts: 245
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Post by Azafuse on Jun 21, 2011 11:48:13 GMT -6
Howard had such an amazing mind indeed, like his mentor HPL.
Unfortunately, his mind was also his biggest foe.
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Post by thegreyelf on Jul 1, 2011 12:13:09 GMT -6
My only real criticism of Howard's early work was his overuse of adverbs. He had a nearly Stephanie Meyer-like love of -ly words. It doesn't grate as much to me as when Meyer does it, but I would be disingenuous to criticize her for it and not him.
He could just as easily have written:
Over shadowy spires and gleaming towers lay the ghostly darkness and silence that runs before dawn. Into a dim alley, one of a veritable labyrinth of mysterious winding ways, four masked figures slipped from a door which a dusky hand eased open. They spoke not but glided into the gloom, cloaks wrapped about them; as silent as the ghosts of murdered men, they disappeared in the darkness. Behind them a sardonic countenance was framed in the crack of the door; a pair of evil eyes glittered in the gloom.
Just as much atmosphere and, IMHO, much tighter prose.
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rjkuntz
Level 5 Thaumaturgist
Pioneer of OD&D
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Post by rjkuntz on Dec 21, 2012 16:03:56 GMT -6
Yeah. But you're paid by the word as a free-lance writer. So Howard wrote LOTS of words.
I have grown pretty tired of his straight S&S Conan tales, but like his weirder tales, Kull, and others these days.
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Post by crusssdaddy on Dec 21, 2012 22:20:05 GMT -6
My only real criticism of Howard's early work was his overuse of adverbs. He had a nearly Stephanie Meyer-like love of -ly words. It doesn't grate as much to me as when Meyer does it, but I would be disingenuous to criticize her for it and not him. He could just as easily have written: Over shadowy spires and gleaming towers lay the ghostly darkness and silence that runs before dawn. Into a dim alley, one of a veritable labyrinth of mysterious winding ways, four masked figures slipped from a door which a dusky hand eased open. They spoke not but glided into the gloom, cloaks wrapped about them; as silent as the ghosts of murdered men, they disappeared in the darkness. Behind them a sardonic countenance was framed in the crack of the door; a pair of evil eyes glittered in the gloom.Just as much atmosphere and, IMHO, much tighter prose. You're certainly entitled to your opinion of Howard's writing, however fewer words is not always synonymous with "tighter prose," and I think the richness of the scene the author conjures is diminished by your edit.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 22, 2012 21:21:58 GMT -6
Well, at least it isn't THE EYE OF ARGON.
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Post by Finarvyn on Dec 23, 2012 7:04:04 GMT -6
I have grown pretty tired of his straight S&S Conan tales, but like his weirder tales, Kull, and others these days. I still love his straight S&S Conan, but (depending upon my mood) Howard is probably my favorite author of all time so I tend to like almost everything he wrote. Heck, I actually enjoyed a couple of his boxing stories. I mean, who writes boxing stories? I certainly agree that his weird stuff is really great. I like Howard's Mythos writings a lot more than HPL's Mythos stuff, which is probably a blasphemy. And his Solomon Kane character ranks among his best. I may enjoy him even more than Conan. (Again, depends upon my mood at the time....)
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Post by Ghul on Dec 23, 2012 7:52:03 GMT -6
I have grown pretty tired of his straight S&S Conan tales, but like his weirder tales, Kull, and others these days. I still love his straight S&S Conan, but (depending upon my mood) Howard is probably my favorite author of all time so I tend to like almost everything he wrote. Heck, I actually enjoyed a couple of his boxing stories. I mean, who writes boxing stories? I certainly agree that his weird stuff is really great. I like Howard's Mythos writings a lot more than HPL's Mythos stuff, which is probably a blasphemy. And his Solomon Kane character ranks among his best. I may enjoy him even more than Conan. (Again, depends upon my mood at the time....) I'm with Fin on this one. I love HPL, and I have since I was a kid, but there is something about Howard that just fires my imagination and creative energy like no other. Like Stephen King once said, "Howard's writing seems so highly charged with energy that it nearly gives off sparks." Recently I re-read all the Solomon Kane yarns as well as Bran Mak Morn; both of these in their recent Del Rey editions that include all the historical notes and wonderful illustrations. Although Conan is probably the REH character that is most dear to my heart for a variety of reasons (and I'm not discounting the nostalgia of my youth, lying in bed and reading Savage Sword of Conan mags), I think the Bran Mak Morn story, Worms of the Earth, may well be my favorite.
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Post by geoffrey on Dec 23, 2012 10:45:07 GMT -6
I think the Bran Mak Morn story, Worms of the Earth, may well be my favorite. That's my favorite Howard story.
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Post by tombowings on Dec 23, 2012 17:54:13 GMT -6
My only real criticism of Howard's early work was his overuse of adverbs. He had a nearly Stephanie Meyer-like love of -ly words. It doesn't grate as much to me as when Meyer does it, but I would be disingenuous to criticize her for it and not him. Wait. Are you admitting to having read Twilight?
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rjkuntz
Level 5 Thaumaturgist
Pioneer of OD&D
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Post by rjkuntz on Dec 23, 2012 18:21:36 GMT -6
I have grown pretty tired of his straight S&S Conan tales, but like his weirder tales, Kull, and others these days. I still love his straight S&S Conan, but (depending upon my mood) Howard is probably my favorite author of all time so I tend to like almost everything he wrote. Heck, I actually enjoyed a couple of his boxing stories. I mean, who writes boxing stories? I certainly agree that his weird stuff is really great. I like Howard's Mythos writings a lot more than HPL's Mythos stuff, which is probably a blasphemy. And his Solomon Kane character ranks among his best. I may enjoy him even more than Conan. (Again, depends upon my mood at the time....) Yeah. The Solomon Kane stories are probably his best, more fleshed out and realized; and REH had to slow the writing pace a bit to accomplish that. Otherwise he moves slightly too fast for me, not like Lovecraft who is glacial in speed, and at times becomes very turgid. Smith always struck a wonderful balance between the other two for me and not by sacrificing any of the weird and strange doing so.
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mythos
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Post by mythos on Dec 27, 2012 13:51:37 GMT -6
Yeah. But you're paid by the word as a free-lance writer. So Howard wrote LOTS of words. That was the real trick for Howard and the other pulp writers. Write enough that the reward was worth the effort of writing. But, don't write so much that the editor would feel the story could not be printed in a single issue, or broken into easy parts to be printed over several issues. And hope that the story was liked enough that you would get the cover art based on it. My understanding being that if you made the cover, there was extra money to be had. Then sending it off and praying that it would be accepted. Remember, this was the day of no advance. You put all the work and effort into creating a story and then had to wait to see if they wanted it, might want it with re-writes, or like the concept but feel the story was not meeting their needs at the time. Then, if it was what they wanted, you had to wait until it was printed before you got paid for it. On paper Howard was one of the richest men in Cross Plains Tx. at the time of his death. But he was still waiting for Weird Tales to send him monies owed him from over a year previously. Howard, imo, hit the perfect balance between word count and story telling. He knew how to keep the action going, and when to slow down and let the story tell itself. Yes, the quality does vary between his work. But also remember, he was sometimes writing three of four stories a month for various publishers. So I can forgive him if there is some slippage. One thing I want to throw in here. If you have not read them, I strongly recommend reading his Breckenridge Elkins stories. They are among the best comedic stories I've ever read. Yes, they are a western setting. Yes, the main character is larger then life. But, imo, they highlight some of the best of Howard's style and ability to present a well developed character.
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Post by geoffrey on Dec 27, 2012 18:36:44 GMT -6
And hope that the story was liked enough that you would get the cover art based on it. My understanding being that if you made the cover, there was extra money to be had. That is correct. A story earned more money if it was the cover story. It is for precisely this reason that Howard searched for ways to wedge in naked beauties into most of his Conan stories. Not because the story called for them, but because these beauties were the key to getting on the cover. Margaret Brundage drew eye-catching nudes.
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Post by thegreyelf on Jan 15, 2013 10:44:40 GMT -6
My only real criticism of Howard's early work was his overuse of adverbs. He had a nearly Stephanie Meyer-like love of -ly words. It doesn't grate as much to me as when Meyer does it, but I would be disingenuous to criticize her for it and not him. Wait. Are you admitting to having read Twilight? In graduate school I took a class on Resources for Young Adults. It was required reading (with apologies from the professors) because it is, in fact, what young people were reading. Nevertheless, I got through a scant few chapters before I quite literally hurled it across the room in rage and disgust.
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