It's fascinating how you discover stuff in D&D you thought you knew but are in fact different. I didn't pay attention to the Druid entry in Greyhawk because I thought I knew about the class. But I forgot that Eldritch Wizardry came afterwards and the Druid as we know him didn't exist when Greyhawk was published. Let's see:
DRUIDS: These men are priests of a neutral-type religion, and as such they differ in armor class and hit dice, as well as in movement capability, and are combination clerics/magic-users. Magic-use ranges from 5th through 7th level, while clericism ranges from 7th through 9th level. Druids may change shape three times per day, once each to any reptile, bird and animal respectively, from size as small as a raven to as large as a small bear. They will generally (70%) be accompanied by numbers of barbaric followers (fighters), with a few higher-level leaders (2-5 fighters of 2nd-5th levels) and a body of normal men (20-50).
So this NPC is quite different from the standard druid. It's not a cleric subclass with its own spell list but a combination of MU/cleric. If we turned this to a player character it would be some sort of multiclassed character + special ability (change shape) instead of a separate class. I wonder what the thinking behind this NPC "class".
I am considering something along these lines in general. Instead of creating different specific classes, couldn't the combination of the "core four" (thief included) cover most archetypes?
In the beginning of Andre Norton's Quag Keep the Fighter (Milo I believe?) encounters a Druid in the Tavern he visits. He finds the presence of the filthy wild prist as being distasteful...
I may not be - I may not be the fastest - I may not be the tallest - Or the strongest I may not be the best - Or the brightest But one thing I can do better - Than anyone else...That is - To be me (Leonard Nimoy)
Pretty good ideas there. I'd also say: magic-user/thief: bard magic-user/fighter: what it says really, like Elric. mu/cleric/fighter: Ranger cleric/thief: High Priest of every real world organised religion throughout history. ;D
Post by tombowings on Oct 31, 2010 20:37:23 GMT -6
I just noticed something.
Near the top page 13 of Eldritch Wizardry, my copy says: "Magic-Users (Druids)" rather than Clerics (Druids). I'm not sure if this is Is this a just typo or druid that were once a magic-user subclass rather than a cleric subclass and there was a change at the last second.
Last Edit: Oct 31, 2010 20:38:04 GMT -6 by tombowings
The thing that has always bothered me about the druid, is that its a specific kind of "priest" from a particular culture. But as described in this thread, one can see them as something else entirely, a kind of shamen who deals neither with gods nor with magic, but with the animistic forces of nature.
But as described in this thread, one can see them as something else entirely, a kind of shaman who deals neither with gods nor with magic, but with the animistic forces of nature.
I agree. Either way, the Greyhawk druid is my favorite - I prefer them enigmatic, solitary, & unorganized. I would personally keep the druid as its own separate "sub-class":
Druids have the ability to cast magic-user spells of 4th level & below, as well as the ability to cast cleric spells of 5th level & below. At 1st level, Druids gain the ability to change shape 3x/day (as listed per Greyhawk, p. 34). At the 8th level of experience, druids attract followers (those listed per Greyhawk, p. 34). Druids do not gain the turn undead ability of clerics. Druids must be Neutral in alignment - however, they may lean "Lawful" or "Chaotic" regarding their actions. Druids may wear leather armor & use wooden shields. They may wield clubs, daggers, hand axes, oil, sickles, slings, staves, & swords (short) in combat. Druids may use any magical items which are usable by “all classes” (excluding armor & weapons prohibited by class), as well as items normally usable by both clerics & magic-users. They advance in experience points as follows: 1 - 4000; 2 - 8000; 3 - 16000; 4 - 32000; 5 - 60000; 6 - 100000; 7 - 175000; 8 - 250000; 9 - 325000. Druids advance in spellcasting ability as clerics, using both the hit dice & saving throws of magic-users. They retain spellbooks as do magic-users.
On a related note I got to meet Dennis Sustare at NTX RPGCON a few years ago. Very cool guy. He is listed as the 'original Druid' in some of the old books and is the 1st person to actually play a Druid from my understanding
Take me down little Susie, take me down I know you think you're the queen of the underground