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Post by willmark on Sept 4, 2012 9:09:36 GMT -6
Excuse the double post but getting this back OT (somewhat) I'm very close to the rules being done. There is one last section I'm adding then its time to look over the text from a writers perspective. I'm an OK writer, but I'm sure there are parts that don't read as smooth as I'd like them. So when the alpha rules are out you had better be brave  |
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Post by battlebrotherbob on Sept 4, 2012 12:11:18 GMT -6
I am very brave. ;D I don't think we drifted too far OT. Defining what the game can and cannot do is very important.
I agree Boot Hill, Top Secret, and Gangbusters really needs either a DM who can poke and prod players along a path without being overbearing, or players who have a very well defined sense of what they want out of the game.
I'm still torn on the need for skills in this game, and what they should be. A simple skill system could really enhance BH with a little bit of work.
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Post by revgunn on Sept 4, 2012 15:40:05 GMT -6
I'm brave. Unless its like reading Korean stereo instructions or something. Cuz I ain't Korean.
I'm really hoping for a cinematic and deadly combat system.
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Post by willmark on Sept 4, 2012 16:17:09 GMT -6
You guys might be in luck. I might have it for you to download tonight. Again no hype, stab at a game design and hopefully it works well. I'm brave. Unless its like reading Korean stereo instructions or something. Cuz I ain't Korean. LOL well hopefully its not THAT BAD. Its presented well I think but I've been writing it so long there is probably plenty I'm mentally filling in for the game. I also changed some core mechanics a couple of times so there might be some artifacts from its earlier revisions. I think I've caught all the references to its former fantasy rpg roots. As far as design, just in word right now before I fire up InDesign and make it into a real product. Once up to some of the more cryptic threads I was asking over at DF should be more apparent. |
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Post by jmccann on Sept 5, 2012 19:17:51 GMT -6
Episodic is probably the best word that describes a western. The best westerns (no pun intended) have a flow to them. I very much like sandbox play but in a western there has to be a bit more guidance. I think Gang Busters is similar but Metamorphsis Alpha and Gamma World are more akin to D&D. I've been reviewing the Boot Hill modules reflect writers not sure how to treat the genre. I'm not the only one who's seen this. I think a western sandbox is possible depending on the players but that is true of almost any RPG. Jmmcann- I think you would be fine with that because the G series isn't really a sandbox, but neither is it a railroad, in a way it reads like a somewhat, open ended script. I think we are thinking of roughly the same thing. Less open-ended than sandbox but not on rails, with short story arcs lasting a session or two. For me anyway I would not have an expectation of a long-lived campaign - more of a side game that would occasionally be good for a couple of sessions. The same players and NPCs could be used, and a history built up, but I think it is harder to achieve the depth of a full campaign w/ this genre. |
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Post by willmark on Sept 6, 2012 7:36:07 GMT -6
Yep I agree with your assement.
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Keps
Level 4 Theurgist
Posts: 118
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Post by Keps on Apr 4, 2014 19:39:48 GMT -6
Episodic is probably the best word that describes a western. The best westerns (no pun intended) have a flow to them. I very much like sandbox play but in a western there has to be a bit more guidance. I think Gang Busters is similar but Metamorphsis Alpha and Gamma World are more akin to D&D. I've been reviewing the Boot Hill modules reflect writers not sure how to treat the genre. I'm not the only one who's seen this. I think a western sandbox is possible depending on the players but that is true of almost any RPG. Jmmcann- I think you would be fine with that because the G series isn't really a sandbox, but neither is it a railroad, in a way it reads like a somewhat, open ended script. I think we are thinking of roughly the same thing. Less open-ended than sandbox but not on rails, with short story arcs lasting a session or two. For me anyway I would not have an expectation of a long-lived campaign - more of a side game that would occasionally be good for a couple of sessions. The same players and NPCs could be used, and a history built up, but I think it is harder to achieve the depth of a full campaign w/ this genre. The campaign could center around a town and it's growth. Like Deadwood or Hell on Wheels. Your characters(multiple)go in and out of various scenarios. If a character is wounded, he's down for a week or two anyhow. Railroad or sandbox depends on the players. Are you doing your job, or are you invested in the town, responsible for a family...then the dreaded "railroad". You take a mission and finish it. Or, are you a murderhobo with no ties, running and stealing? Go as far as you can(1 session). |
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Post by willmark on May 15, 2014 13:01:24 GMT -6
It's certainly one way to look at it.
I think people are stuck on the mode of how traditional fantasy games run and see westerns boring as a result. This is odd since a generation ago playing. " cowboys and Indians" was roleplaying. I also believe that people are do used to the "crutches" afforded by fantasy RPGs that anything else seems odd.
To sum up, yes town based can work but it needs to have a strong character/NPC reason for it. Think the movie Silverado in that sense.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Sept 27, 2014 20:48:20 GMT -6
I joined this board because of this thread. I love the ideas here. I played 2e Boot Hill for quite a while. The combat was so deadly, but somehow I had a character that lived for a long time in a campaign. The GM was great, but I honestly think a lot of it was just how he used the luck of what happened in the episodic encounters he planned to bring them back and build a longer more involved story. I started out just a guy in town in who became a deputy, locked an NPC up for a night. Eventually the character became a sheriff periodically the NPC that had been locked up made more appearances, killed other PC's friendly NPC's and a real rivalry threaded it's way in and out of the campaign. The way all the characters reacted and changed is what made the campaign a success. Despite the deadliness of the combat somehow luck determined that both the character and the rival NPC lived through combat after combat with each other. It really built the tension and provided a through-line even when there other events going on.
But it was crazy because many of the PC's went through many characters and I think their attachment to the campaign might have been hurt by that. As fun and deadly as the combat was, the repeated dying of characters did make it more difficult for many PC's to form the same attachment to the campaign. Combat shouldn't be a walk in the park and should probably be deadlier than many other RPG's, but just tweaked a bit from BH in order to have more of a chance for characters to develop and grow.
No matter what I would love to keep up with whatever comes out of all of this. It sounds really cool, and I'd love to be a supporter.
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Post by Finarvyn on Sept 28, 2014 6:05:23 GMT -6
On another board I saw a suggestion that each player come up with a "family tree" with the idea that if one member of the family dies another could show up to wreck vengence. It also would explain the sudden appearance of another character with the same stats.  Boot Hill characters are pretty fast to re-roll, but I love the idea. |
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Post by rastusburne on Oct 23, 2014 14:20:17 GMT -6
Loving this thread! Did you end up completing your clone Finarvyn?
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Post by willmark on Nov 16, 2014 6:53:46 GMT -6
Can't speak for Finaryn but here's where I ended up:
At first I was keen to just add on to 2nd Ed Boot Hill; the problem became as Gary pointed out on a QA thread at DF: BH is a miniatures game with a skeletal rig attracted.
I tried giving it ago but because there are so many holes it started to become more and more of my own game, hence the reasons why I created Hurled into Eternity. It's not the BH is bad, it's just there is a lot of stuff missing and some things that work ok, others need work.
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Post by Finarvyn on Nov 16, 2014 7:11:20 GMT -6
Loving this thread! Did you end up completing your clone Finarvyn? I did a lot of the mathematical conversion to a d20 system, which I liked better at the time, then tried to decide if I should stick to percentile. I need to go back to tinker with it. I really like the way it was shaping up, but clearly it's not designed to be "complete" since BH isn't "complete" in the way that we think about RPGs today. |
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Post by willmark on Feb 15, 2015 8:16:42 GMT -6
I don't know so much of its a need for a western rpg to be "developed" so much as it needs a better flow, or at least a different approach then a traditional rpg. Sorry to flog a dead horse here but the more I re-watch westerns the more I become convinced that a western rpg needs to follow the flow episodically.
So I don't think complete matters per say more then the action IMO.
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Post by ukgendarme on May 31, 2015 16:06:57 GMT -6
Is the BootHill reboot, clone or other still in the works??
Also, an experience point, different levels of advancement, skills, karma (or reputation) concerning actions and/or
decisions made etc. would make it a real RPG and not just a combat game.
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Post by krusader74 on Oct 16, 2016 14:52:16 GMT -6
This weekend, I began work on a BH 1E retro-clone. So far, its about 20 pages as a digest sized PDF. It only implements the basic rules so far. My TODO list for it is at the end of the doc. Here are the links: Here is an image of the cover of the PDF:  |
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