AD&D's emphasis on the planes (compared to D&D)

[geoffrey]

D&D in 1974-5 has little in the rulebooks regarding the other planes of existence or the denizens thereof. There are elementals, the contact higher plane spell, and a handful of other unsystematized references.

Demons were added to the mix with the 1976 publication of Eldritch Wizardry, and in The Dragon #8 (July 1977) Gary first published what became AD&D's standard planar model. In that article Gary wrote, "As of this writing I foresee a number of important things arising from the adoption of this system. First, it will cause a careful rethinking of much of the justification for the happenings in the majority of D&D campaigns. Second, it will vastly expand the potential of all campaigns which adopt the system — although it will mean tremendous additional work for these DMs. Different planes will certainly have different laws and different inhabitants (although some of these beings will be familiar). Whole worlds are awaiting creation, complete invention, that is. Magical/technological/whatever items need be devised. And ways to move to these planes must be provided for discovery by players. Third, and worst from this writer’s point of view, it will mean that I must revise the whole of D&D to conform to this new notion. Under the circumstances, I think it best to do nothing more than offer the idea for your careful consideration and thorough experimentation. This writer has used only parts of the system in a limited fashion. It should be tried and tested before adoption."

When I think of the differences between OD&D and AD&D, the latter's greater emphasis on the planes always strikes me as a distinct difference in feel. For some reason when I think of 1974-1975 D&D, I think of dungeons and Wilderlands-style wilderness exploration. When I think of AD&D, I think of demons, devils, the outer planes, etc.

[coffee]

I have to agree with your assessment.

In OD&D, even with Eldritch Wizardry, it's most likely that a demon (for instance) would show up here and start something, which the pc's will then have to stop. But in AD&D, you have the illustration right in the player's handbook, A Paladin in Hell -- it looks like you're meant to go after them on their home turf.

But I do find it amusing that the AD&D Contact Higher Planes spell doesn't jibe with the planar arrangement Gary made out. It sill only goes 1-6 planes higher, or whatever. That always bugged me, until I finally found out that the spell predated the planes.

[leon]

Jul 3, 2010 9:04:39 GMT -6 geoffrey said:

Under the circumstances, I think it best to do nothing more than offer the idea for your careful consideration and thorough experimentation. This writer has used only parts of the system in a limited fashion. It should be tried and tested before adoption.

It's funny that this "experimental" planar system stayed pretty much unchanged in every subsequent edition of D&D.

When I think of the differences between OD&D and AD&D, the latter's greater emphasis on the planes always strikes me as a distinct difference in feel. For some reason when I think of 1974-1975 D&D, I think of dungeons and Wilderlands-style wilderness exploration. When I think of AD&D, I think of demons, devils, the outer planes, etc.

I don't know when the D&D cosmology entered the game, but a more primitive form which was the basis for the outer planes, was published in SR 6 (February 1976), in the article about alignment. Heaven, Elysium, the Abyss, Hell, Nirvana, Limbo, even devils, were mentioned therein. So perhaps a planar cosmology was used in the game even earlier.

The nice thing though, is that if one needs a cosmological model for his OD&D campaign, there's a ready-made one, without having to resort to later editions of the game. Truly, OD&D has everything one needs to run a D&D game.

[snorri]

It's not even clear there are elemental planes in the lbb's. As a large body of water is necessary to call a water elemental, and a volcano or another source of heat for a fire elemental, I would argue they come from the nature itself and not anaother plan.

Efrits come from the fabulous city of Brass - but who said it's on another plan? Maybe you can go there by foot, on a camel back, trough the outdoor survival map.

About creatures, the main 'outsider' is the Invisible stalker, coming from the Non-Dimension. I'm fond of that concept, which sounds very lovecraftian, and feel the poor stalker loose soemthing when he became a standard citizen of the air elemental plan.

[geoffrey]

Jul 17, 2010 16:12:24 GMT -6 snorri said:

Efrits come from the fabulous city of Brass - but who said it's on another plan? Maybe you can go there by foot, on a camel back...

That's exactly what happens in The 1,001 Nights.

[James Maliszewski]

Aside from its greater rules complexity and depth, the biggest thing AD&D brings to the table that OD&D doesn't is a cosmology. As others have noted, OD&D is largely devoid of suppositions about the world beyond the immediate campaign area and what little it does offer is vague and intended primarily as a spur to adventure rather than as a statement about the true nature of the cosmos.

Part of it, I think, is that AD&D was intended to be a universal system that linked all campaigns together through common rules and setting suppositions. There's a belief that all AD&D campaigns exist within the same cosmos, which is not true of OD&D. That's why the AD&D rules defined the existence of certain planes and otherworldly beings, topics about which OD&D is mostly silent.

[blackbarn]

Good observations, all. Snorri, I like the way you described it... but then I was never a fan of using other planes in the game. Never having played any higher level games, all the planar stuff seemed like so much wasted space in the AD&D books to me. It felt like a barrier... stuff you'd never really get to deal with as a PC because it was harder to deal with and travel to. I suppose that is partly due to personal preference of my group though.