Classic features of an Arnesonian dungeon

[geordie]

What are the classic features ?

What differentiates Dave's dungeons from Gary's ?

[tavis]

Judging just from FFC and Temple of the Frog -

1) Intersections are not right angles; hallways do not run according to the compass rose.
2) Some rooms have a lot of foes! Temple of the Frog especially stands out in this regard.

[aldarron]

Agreeing with Tavis. The question is a litttle tough because Gygax wrote so much stuff. In general I think Arneson's modules were a little looser with had less of an interest in linear missions - "go do x" and more emphasis on setting up scenarios which players could approach with whatever goals they pleased. Kinda sorta anyway. Garbage pits and DNA/DOA are both pretty mission oriented but players have a number of options regarding what side they choose or what outcomes they want. Haunted Lighthouse is pretty much a one way affair, IIRC, but it was a tournament mod so maybe a bit different. <shrug> Interesting question

[aldarron]

May 9, 2010 18:10:42 GMT -6 tavis said:

Judging just from FFC and Temple of the Frog -

1) Intersections are not right angles; hallways do not run according to the compass rose.

Just thinking a little more about this lately and it really is a noticeable hallmark of Arnesons dungeons. If you look at the maps Gygax did, Tharizdun for example or the photos floating around of the Greyhawk dungeon maps or the sample dungeon in the DMG - they are all basically right angle affairs square block rooms and right angle corridors.

Arnesons dungeons in FFC and Totf are all non right/bent angles with many multishaped rooms.

interesting, that.

[Morandir]

I was just looking at these for the first time last night and that was the first thing I noticed. My second thought was, "my players would go nuts trying to map those!"

[grodog]

Gary and Rob regularly created maps at non-right-angles for Castle Greyhawk; for an excellent example, see images.boardgamegeek.com/images/pic516268_lg.jpg

[Deleted]

Blackmoor in general had tougher monsters and much less treasure than Greyhawk. So much so that it was not unknown for a player get a character up to 5th or 6th level and retire them.

[aldarron]

Aug 16, 2011 9:15:43 GMT -6 grodog said:

Gary and Rob regularly created maps at non-right-angles for Castle Greyhawk; for an excellent example, see images.boardgamegeek.com/images/pic516268_lg.jpg

Thanks for the pic Allen, that's one I hadn't seen before. I may have overemphasized the case a bit when I wrote "all" and should have said "mostly". If you compare the map in that pic to, say this one blackmoormystara.blogspot.com/2010/11/shaedraeth-update.html

I think you'll see what I mean.

[grodog]

De nada re: the pic

I'll have to pull out FFC again, aldarron---my recollection of its levels definitely doesn't jibe with the characterization of their angularity* vs. GH, but it has absolutely been years since I've looked at it last, too. And, either way, I'm sure both maps would be fun to play and challenge to map in their own ways

* FWIW, if you rotate the level 6 BM map 45 degrees relative to the grid, it's a lot more right-angly than it initially appears to be---which isn't to say that the other levels may not be less "on grid" than that one, either!