claw/claw/bite

[kesher]

So, anyone know the origins of this paradigm of monster attack? I mean, I know it first appeared in Greyhawk, but I'm wondering about the thought process. It really changes the dynamics of monster-use, and I find it interesting in its appearance alongside variable weapon damage.

I'm not being very clear: What's the thought behind many monsters being able to attack multiple times vs. characters who can only really attack once? How does it change monster use as opposed to the LBB, where everyone attacks once and does (pretty much) the same damage?

[Haldo Bramwise]

I would like to know this as well. Good question.

[thegreyelf]

Well, remember that in the LBBs, it's stated that monsters should gain one attack as a "man" type per hit die. If you follow the logic of the Chainmail combat system and progression, players gain multiple attacks as well (1 man, 2 men, 3 men + 1, etc.)

I always figured this was just a streamlining of that. Instead of the (ridiculous) one attack per hit die, they just gave certain creatures attack routines.

[Finarvyn]

I suspect it comes down to parties of characters surrounding single monsters and wiping them out without much of a challenge. Dragons no longer scare people? Give 'em claw and bite attacks so they can infict misery on several foes at a time!

[Haldo Bramwise]

Hey Jason, I sent you a PM. They are hard to spot on this forum sometimes.

[cooper]

Red Dragon
att/def: heavy horse
hits: 3cumulative
dmg: 3d6

translating into d&d one medium/heavy horse counts as 3HD (3:1 is the attack modifier that an armored hero needs to score a "hit") damage is converted at 1:2 for medium/heavy horse. 1:2 is the ratio at which a heavy horse damages an armored hero.

red dragon: ac -1
hits: 9 HD
dmg 6d6 (1d6/1d6/4d6) claw claw bite

troll:
att/def: heavy foot
hits: 6 cumulative
dmg: 6d6

heavy foot translates at 1:1, dmg translates as 1:2

ac: 5
hits 6HD (or 6 "hits" from a hero with a swords average on a d6 3.5)
dmg 3d6 (1d6-1, 1d6-1, 2d6) claw claw bite (or d4x2 2d6)

ogre:
att/def: HF
hits: 4c
dmg: 4d6
ac: 5
HD: 4
dmg: 2d6



Look at the Giant:
att/def: HF
hits: 12
dmg: 12d6

heavy foot is 1:1 basis for how a 4th level armored foot would fight. However, the damage of heavy foot is on a 1:2 ratio.

Cloud Giant
AC 5
hit points (12HD)
dmg 6d6

Not surprisingly the default giant in CHAINMAIL is 12 heavy foot and the spread in D&D is from 8 (hill giant) to 16 (titan)

this is too easy.

[cooper]

I fixed an error with the troll and 3 horse dragon and added the ogre.

[cooper]

Maybe more germain. In the man-to-man rules for chainmail, starting in the 2nd round after the initial charge, a horse gets two attacks per turn in addition to the 1 attack of the rider. (pg. 25).

Extrapolating an animal without a rider, but with a "maw" that can bite, viola 3 attacks per turn. Claw/claw/bite.

edit: technically only medium and heavy horse get 2 attacks, light horse get 1 attack only in addition to the rider.