|
Post by Finarvyn on May 12, 2008 12:53:35 GMT -6
TSR did a Conan RPG back in the 1980's. You can find the boxed set along with the (3?) modules sometimes on e-bay. They are not D&D based, but instead are more of a skill-system type game. I have a copy of the game but have never actually played it. The general rules system seems pretty light to play and the main rulebook is only something like 32 pages in length. There's a discussion about this game here at rpg.netA wonderful thread on DF leads one to this place. "This place" is something called the ZeFRS RPG, which is essentially the TSR Conan RPG with the setting stuff stripped away. Anyone play this game? What do you think about the system?
|
|
|
Post by dwayanu on May 12, 2008 13:24:13 GMT -6
The rules are a variation on the original Marvel Super Heroes game. There's a game on the 'net called Four Colors that emulates MSH, if you want to check it out. The Universal Table in Conan is a bit different, and complexity is in the neighborhood of Advanced MSH. There is naturally more detail at the "human scale," especially concerning abilities, skills and weapons.
I've given the Conan game just one short try as a "one off," but I think it's worthy of extended play. The designers did a fine job of conveying the flavor of Howard's tales, and the book of background material and monsters (presented in the conceit of a "scholarly manuscript") is nice.
That first time, character creation took a while but seemed well-rewarded. Play was very brisk. The rules provide a lot of "color" without a lot of work.
Based on that first impression, I think the game very elegantly balances "gritty" and "larger than life" aspects. The mix felt better to me than in Hyborian Age AD&D games. It seems not to have gotten much attention when it was released, but I would recommend it as being very much worth obtaining.
|
|
|
Post by dwayanu on May 12, 2008 14:04:12 GMT -6
A quick glance at "ZeFRS" suggests that it's a pretty good translation.
You'll definitely want the GM Screen. One neat feature of MSH is that all the commonly used combat tables (what a given color of result means in a given context) fit on one page.
Given the similarity, I suppose one might borrow some rules from MSH or 4C.
A big difference from most fantasy games is the absence of a set list of spells. Gaining a spell generally involves (a) acquiring and poring over a musty tome; and (b) obtaining weird ingredients: purple lotus powder, mummy dust, dragon bone, or the like.
It's up to the GM to decide what's possible and what's required, and up to the player's determination, cunning and luck to fulfill the quest. Over all, I think the approach gives the feel of classic sword-and-sorcery fiction better than any formalized "system" I've seen.
|
|
|
Post by doc on May 12, 2008 16:53:27 GMT -6
I actually owned this game back when it first came out! My cousin, who was a big Conan geek, bought it for me so that I could GM it for him Years later after not even looking at it for over a decade I gave it to a friend of mine who was enamored with all things Conan. I remember it being a lot of fun, but it took a little while to get used to the "no stats, no classes" concept behind the game. I actually ran a successful Conan game using the Arduin Grimoire rules a few years back, but I'll always have fond memories of being 13 and sending my cousin's hulking 7' tall barbarian on suicide missions against the Picts and Hyperboreans. Doc
|
|
|
Post by murquhart72 on May 12, 2008 18:58:43 GMT -6
I never liked it when it first came out. But then, I was just a kid. I bookmarked the link to purview later...
|
|
|
Post by kesher on May 12, 2008 22:11:39 GMT -6
I bought this at Games by James right when it first came out. I still have it, though at some point I actually cannibalized the box, cutting out the cover and stapling(!) it to a folder, within which I kept everything else for the game. I'd have to go check, but I think I even wrote at least one adventure for it. We didn't play it very much, but it was enjoyable, really different than the heavy AD&D we'd been previously immersed in. As for the magic system, at the time I thought the lack of spell lists was a cop-out, but am now better able to appreciate such things...
|
|
|
Post by dwayanu on May 12, 2008 22:46:21 GMT -6
It may have been ahead of its time. I'll bet a lot of folks who dig "rules light" games today had their noses stuck in the likes of RoleMaster back then.
A few years ago, when I was giving "D&D v. 3" a try as a player, it was suggested that I should run a superhero game for a change of pace. I'd just bought Hero System 5th Edition, somehow thinking I might use it as something other than a doorstop -- but ended up using MSH.
Early on, one of the players exclaimed, "This really is simple!" I had said so beforehand, but he seemed genuinely (and perhaps a bit ambivalently) surprised, almost shocked.
Even though it covers a lot of things in more detail, it might still come off as even simpler than OD&D. In terms of speed of play, I think MSH and Conan are about on par with OD&D.
To some kids, that makes it a "kids' game" for which they're too old. To some oldsters, that makes it a "beer and skittles" game for which they may not be too old to spare some energy after playing Papers & Paychecks for real all day.
I like the relative lack of distraction from the action, the ability to pack a lot of adventure into the time a single fight might take with more complex rules.
|
|
sham
Level 6 Magician
Posts: 385
|
Post by sham on May 13, 2008 8:38:57 GMT -6
Thanks for the heads up Fin, and thanks for the enlightening comments Dwayanu.
I printed off the PDF from the ZeFRS site.
It looks like a perfect system for a rules light S&S campaign.
I looked on eBay for TSR's Conan, no dice though. That's a game that I'd love to add to my collection.
Hopefully I'll have time to digest all of it soon...for now it's in my binder next to Encounter Critical!
|
|
|
Post by Finarvyn on May 13, 2008 10:45:12 GMT -6
Iat the time I thought the lack of spell lists was a cop-out, but am now better able to appreciate such things... I'm still torn on the matter. While I enjoy a system that allows me to create spells "on the fly" or to customize them as desired, I also like to see a sample spell list so that I don't have to do this. I still think it's a cop-out, even if I appreciate the options otherwise.
|
|
|
Post by dwayanu on May 13, 2008 11:48:20 GMT -6
It's been a long time since that session, but I don't recall the Conan game as missing a method to handle any situation. Having run MSH a lot, I'll say that for all their brevity the rules make a very adequate "world machine."
I don't refer to the powers list in MSH unless I'm using a character write-up from TSR that itself does so. It's just so easy to come up with a game effect corresponding to any "real-world" phenomenon (albeit probably with the less than strict realism of the genre).
With that kind of resource at hand, the only reason for a spell list is to make magic more a "technology" that sorcerers manipulate with reliable knowledge.
The intent is just the opposite! Magic in the Hyborian Age is an art of mystery and peril even to its practitioners. I don't ever recall from Howard's stories an enchantment being indicated as "just a standard X spell."* Orders and individuals possess jealously guarded secrets, apparently not products of modern innovation but wrested from ancient grimoires or otherworldly entities.
At least, that's my impression from reading the tales.
*That would be more evocative of (e.g.) Vance's Dying Earth.
|
|
|
Post by coffee on May 13, 2008 11:52:41 GMT -6
I looked on eBay for TSR's Conan, no dice though. That's a game that I'd love to add to my collection. So did I. The game isn't there, but you can get all three modules (plus an AD&D Conan module), so it's not all bad.
|
|
sham
Level 6 Magician
Posts: 385
|
Post by sham on May 13, 2008 19:18:55 GMT -6
Wayne's World of Books has a used copy for $70. USD and a 'new' copy for $100. USD. at this link: www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/0880383542/ref=dp_olp_2I like the ZeFRS PDF so far, but I'd also love to read the Hyborian setting information. $70. bucks isn't bad, but for me it would likely end up as a novelty item. I'll have to think about it. So many games and so little time, and all that.
|
|
|
Post by coffee on May 14, 2008 10:09:04 GMT -6
So many games and so little time, and all that. Oh, how true that is!
|
|
|
Post by dwayanu on May 14, 2008 13:06:27 GMT -6
I hate to think of how much it would cost to replace my former collection of games!
|
|
busman
Level 6 Magician
Playing OD&D, once again. Since 2008!
Posts: 448
|
Post by busman on May 14, 2008 14:12:31 GMT -6
I hate to think of how much it would cost to replace my former collection of games! Taking inflation into account, probably not as much as you spent on it when first acquiring it. Really collecting in our hobby is still in it's infancy, and most things are still a relative bargain. Less than cover price isn't uncommon to see. Twice cover price probably covers the vast majority of anything not really rare. For example, over the last year or so, I've picked up the following at no more than twice-thrice cover price or less: OEPT Traveller All ODD Supplements (including 1st prints on 3 of them) All JG D&D and Traveller commons Holmes Basic Moldvay B/X Metzner BECMI All AD&D books, modules, etc. more It's all very readily available. If you're looking for NM+ still in shrink, yeah, you're going to pay more. But I doubt that was what your original collection was either.
|
|
|
Post by dwayanu on May 14, 2008 19:54:43 GMT -6
I was thinking more of the wargames, but I'll admit I haven't been searching Ebay and so on assiduously.
Traveller LBBs? Cool!
|
|
busman
Level 6 Magician
Playing OD&D, once again. Since 2008!
Posts: 448
|
Post by busman on May 14, 2008 22:21:56 GMT -6
I was thinking more of the wargames, but I'll admit I haven't been searching Ebay and so on assiduously. Traveller LBBs? Cool! Yeah. Classic Traveller is really in the tank right now. 3 LBBs can be picked up for less than $30 if you're patient. Whole set of Supplements for less than $3 a book. Whole set of books for less than $5 per book. The JG Traveller stuff can be found for 75 cents to no more than $4. I just picked up an unpunched Snapshot for $10. The Paranoia Press stuff is hard to get for less than $40; same with most of the Fasa stuff. But even there, if you look you can find SORAG for $20, etc.
|
|
|
Post by coffee on May 15, 2008 9:19:18 GMT -6
Speaking of Traveller LBBs, I picked up all three over the course of a year and a half or so. They weren't in collectible shape (not mint or anything like that) but they were intact and complete, and I got them for about two bucks each.
These, I might point out, were the original 1977 publications. The ones I used to have, back in the day, were the revised ones from 1980. So it was very cool that I could see where the game came from.
Does anybody know if there is a comprehensive list of things that got changed between the two printings/editions?
|
|
|
Post by codeman123 on Sept 2, 2008 5:39:43 GMT -6
I actually just aquired this game in pdf format and being a big conan fanatic like so many here i like it alot even though i have not actually played a game yet... but have always been a big fan of the ole MSH game anyways...
|
|
|
Post by bigjackbrass on Sept 2, 2008 11:51:48 GMT -6
Does anybody know if there is a comprehensive list of things that got changed between the two printings/editions? Not quite a comprehensive listing, but there has been discussion of the "lost rules" over on Citizens of the Imperium.
|
|
|
Post by greentongue on Sept 2, 2008 15:45:24 GMT -6
I actually just aquired this game in pdf format and being a big conan fanatic like so many here i like it alot even though i have not actually played a game yet... but have always been a big fan of the ole MSH game anyways... You may be interested in Zeb's Fantasy Roleplaying System, or ZeFRS www.midcoast.com/~ricekrwc/zefrs/ =
|
|
|
Post by greentongue on Sept 4, 2008 12:10:59 GMT -6
|
|
|
Post by thegreyelf on Sept 10, 2008 13:10:39 GMT -6
It rocks that people are discovering ZeFRS. As one of those involved with the development of the project (and the guy who formatted the PDF), I'm thrilled to see it garnering some interest. It definitely was a game ahead of its time. There's been some discussion of "re-vamping" it, expanding and redoing that PDF in full color, etc., but I haven't had the time to invest in it. It'd be great to see some discussion get kicking over at the forums, too.
An interesting side note, Dave "Zeb" Cook (ZeFRS stands for "Zeb's Fantasy Roleplaying System") himself popped over to the forums and gave us his blessing on the project, which rocked.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 20, 2008 6:11:10 GMT -6
Just downloaded ZeFRS and it looks interesting. How did you guys get the rights to print it? (Or is this sort of an OGL kind of thing where anyone can print anything as long as it has a twist or two in it?)
|
|
|
Post by thegreyelf on Sept 23, 2008 6:48:57 GMT -6
Well, we are not actually printing it because it falls into a sort of "Grey Area" of indie games. You cannot copyright a rules mechanic; only the expression of the mechanic. So technically as long as we re-phrase the rules (which we did), they are fair game. However, we're not risking a printing because we're not 100% certain the rules are re-phrased enough, especially since we kept the chart intact.
Our intent is that the rules be completely open and public domain, though we would ask that proper credit be given for anyone who uses them. Dave "Zeb" Cook actually showed up on the message boards over there and gave us his blessing, which means a great deal, though presumably (unless one could argue abandonment of the IP) WotC owns the rights to the game which haven't reverted to Conan Properties (i.e. everything that's not Conan-specific).
|
|