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Post by Finarvyn on Jun 12, 2021 13:29:03 GMT -6
...but Amtor so "meh"?
I'm in the process of re-reading Burroughs' Carson of Venus stories, and I haven't read them in enough decades that pretty much everything is brand new to me as if I had never read them. That's a good thing. However, as I read the tales I have this feeling that they just aren't as good as the John Carter stories. The place names and people names of Barsoom just roll off the tongue better than the Amtor ones. Most of the creatures on Barsoom are easy for me to picture, but the Amtorian creatures just don't seem to be as well described. Barsoom has flying ships all over the place, Amtor has ... well, I hate to spoil anything but it's just not as cool.
John Carter got a board game by SPI, a miniatures rules set by TSR, a miniatures rules set by Heritage, and a 2d20 RPG. Also some RPG treatment with many threads trying to convert everything into OD&D terms. A quick search on Google supplies quite a bit of classic artwork by Michael Whelan, Frank Frazetta, and Gino d'Achille. John Carter even got a Disney movie (and another one, which I haven't been able to bring myself to watch).
Carson Napier got a couple of random printings of books and sometimes I can't even figure out exactly what the covers are supposed to be on my Ace paperback set. No RPG. No board game. Little interest or chatter about Carson on the web.
I'm enjoying the stories but where I usually re-read Barsoom every year or two I can see that Amtor might go another decade until a re-read. It's just not as awesome. Am I the only one who feels this way? Tell me why I'm wrong!
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Post by Deleted on Jun 13, 2021 19:06:30 GMT -6
I could find time to read only the first book of Barsoom series as of yet. I'm not familiar with Carson of Venus. Is it in the same "universe" of Barsoom and just another planet? Or is it unrelated?
Well, although I don't have the experience with both series to have a nice discussion about, I could say what I've liked most in Barsoom and why it rapidly became one of my favorite books.
What compelled me to read A Princess of Mars was really this board repeatedly recommendations.
As you've said, I could easily depict the creatures without problem, except by the first time the white apes were described, it took me a while to realize that John Carter was in trouble in that scene and what kind of trouble it was.
What hooked me in, was the highly structured and detailed explained society, the honor system, the weapons and tone. There are good characters, Dejah Thoris is lovely, I was in love with her myself I could say. I like it very much when the character is so cool that you can just feel in the character's skin. When John Carter loved Dejah Thoris I loved Dejah Thoris, when John Carter made a friend, I made a friend, and when John Carter hated an antagonist, I hated the antagonist as well. That's not a common feeling for me, I often prefer the antagonists for some reason, the main characters are normally annoying and even pathetic in some cases, but that was not the case with John Carter.
That's why I've despised the movie, John Carter is a truly awesome character, like you don't often find on books, if there was something they should not have touched in that movie, it is the character's personality itself.
I'll try to take a look in Venus later this month.
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Post by cometaryorbit on Jun 14, 2021 6:32:56 GMT -6
To me, it's two things:
- Setting: Barsoom is its own thing, clearly drawing from a variety of real world inspirations but altering them thoroughly enough that they're "inspirations" only. Amtor is full of direct copies of contemporary RL things (Thorists = Communists, Eugenicists in Havatoo, etc.) sometimes incredibly blunt ones (Zanis = Nazis). And much of this has not aged well: the Thorists and Zanis seem like super generic stock villains now, but these books were written before WWII and the Cold War.
Amtor never really feels like a cohesive world as Barsoom does. It's more a "stage" to set various not-very-related plots.
- Time/originality: many writers get to the point where they're no longer producing their best work/less original, and some of the Venus books are past that point for Burroughs IMO, much as some of the later Tarzan books are basically the same plot over and over.
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Post by Finarvyn on Jun 14, 2021 15:13:43 GMT -6
I could find time to read only the first book of Barsoom series as of yet. I'm not familiar with Carson of Venus. Is it in the same "universe" of Barsoom and just another planet? Or is it unrelated? Yes, both Mars and Venus (and hollow earth Pelucidar and Tarzan) are technically in the same world. I know there are a few crossover stories.
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Post by stevemitchell on Jun 14, 2021 20:08:08 GMT -6
The Mad King and The Eternal Savage are in the same world, too.
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Post by tdenmark on Oct 28, 2021 16:15:02 GMT -6
ERB spent his best ideas on Barsoom.
I still like the Venus books quite a bit, but nothing is as special as those Mars adventures.
I think what happens to a lot of successful creatives is that once they make a bunch of money and become businessmen their minds fill with the concerns of managing their business and less is dedicated to creativity. ie. George Lucas. We all only have so much brain power.
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