Monster Organization in Vol. III

[Haldo Bramwise]

Hey guys.

Simon can give a better answer to this, but I thought I would give my two cents.

I do realize that the monsters section is very hard to follow. A decision was made to keep that section organized as close to the game we are emulating as possible. I introduced the idea of a one-page, alphabetizes list.

One of the reasons that BHP has chosen to also do a full-sized (8.5" x 11"), illustrated version of Delving Deeper RPG in addition to these three little booklets is so that we can have a version Delving Deeper RPG that is much more user-friendly for new and young gamers not familiar with the game Delving Deeper emulates. That version will have all of the monsters listed in alphabetical order.

I hope this helps.

[waysoftheearth]

The monster organisation was another tough challenge.

A feature of the original is that monsters are not organised alphabetically (that practice didn't start until AD&D), but are loosely organised into (un-named) monster "categories", and then loosely arranged in ascending HD within each category.

While this method may seem clunky by some standards, it is actually a very useful organisation for a referee who is looking for "related" monsters of similar HD. In this scenario, the referee merely needs to look at the entries on the same page to get a feel for the similar monsters.

On the other hand, alphabetical organistaion is more useful for flicking through the pages to find a monsters by name.

We've discussed it at length and ultimately decided to have Vol 3 organised in much the same manner as the original. Partly because it's more authentic that way, partly because it works well for particular use cases, and partly because it would have caused another delay to re-organise the layout alphabetically.

What we have also decided to do is to include an alphabetical index of monsters at the end, so there will still be a nice easy way to find monsters by name too.

I hope this helps

[Mike]

I like the listing of creatures by type and HD but the descriptions should have been alphabetical.

I really thought one of the ideas was to take the original and create a more easily digestible guide. This is certainly what you've done elsewhere in the project but the wheel comes off the trolly in this section.

A first-timer to the game would definitely be left scratching their head methinks.

[Sean Michael Kelly]

Sept 13, 2012 5:24:54 GMT -6 Mike said:

I like the listing of creatures by type and HD but the descriptions should have been alphabetical.

I really thought one of the ideas was to take the original and create a more easily digestible guide. This is certainly what you've done elsewhere in the project but the wheel comes off the trolly in this section.

A first-timer to the game would definitely be left scratching their head methinks.

I'd agree with above, but understand the rationale. What would be helpful, IMHO, is not just an alpha index, but simply a second stat list in alpha order too. (for example, some Bibles have the book contents in "canonical order" then immediately following in alpha order)

For the most part, I just use the stat sheets during game play.

[mgtremaine]

Androids, 1-8, 2-24, 9, 12, 3, 15, A2, Any
Animals, ----Various, ----, n/a, n/a, N
Basilisks, 1, 1-6, 5, 6, 6+1, 40, F, C, N
Black, pudding, 1, n/a, 9, 6, 10, n/a, n/a, N
Cavemen, 4-24, 30-300+, 9, 12, 2, 15, n/a, N
Centaurs, 2-20, 30-60, 7, 18, 4, 5, A1, L, N
Chimera, 1-4, 2-12, 3, 12, fl18, 9, 50, F, C
Cockatrices, 1-6, 3-12, 7, 9, fl18, 5, 35, D, C, N
Crabs, giant, 2-12, n/a, 3, 9, 3, n/a, n/a, N
Cyborgs, 1-20, 30-120, 5, 9, 3+3, 15, G, C, N
Cyclops, 1, 1, -2, 18, 13+3, 30, E*, N
Dinosaurs, ----Various, ----, n/a, n/a, N
Djinni, 1, n/a, 4, 9, fl24, 7+1, n/a, n/a, N
Doppelgangers, 1-4, 3-12, 5, 9, 4, 25, E, C, N
Dragon, turtles, 1, 1-2, -2, 3, sw9, 13, 5, H, N
Dragons, 1-2, 1-4, --, Various, --, 60, H, C,L,
Dryads, 1, 1-6, 4, 12, 2, 20, n/a, L, N
Dwarfs, 2-20, 30-120+, 4, 9, 1+1, 50, G, L, N
Efreeti, 1, n/a, 2, 9,fl24, 10, n/a, n/a, C
Elemental, 1, n/a, ----Various, ----, n/a, n/a, N
Elves, 2-20, 30-120+, 5, 12, 1, 25, E, L, N
Fish, giant, 2-24, n/a, 5, sw30, 6, n/a, n/a, N
Gargoyles, 4-16, 2-20, 5, 9, fl15, 4, 25, C, C
Gelatinous, cube, 1, n/a, 9, 6, 4, n/a, *, N
Ghouls, 1-10, 2-24, 7, 9, 2, 20, B, C
Giants, 1-8, 3-30, ----, Various, ----, 30, E*, C, N
Gnolls, 2-12, 20-200+, 6, 9, 2, 30, D, C, N
Gnomes, 2-20, 30-60+, 6, 9, 1, 60, C, L, N
Goblins, 4-24, 40-400+, 7, 6, 1-1, 50, *, C
Golems, clay, 1-6, n/a, 3, 9, 10, n/a, n/a, N
Golems, flesh, 1-6, n/a, 7, 12, 8, n/a, n/a, N
Gorgons, 1-4, 3-12, 2, 12, 8, 50, E, C
Gothrog, 1, 1+, -3, 9, fl18, 20, 25, A2, F, C
Gray, ooze, 1, n/a, 9, 1, 3, n/a, n/a, N
Green, slime, 1, n/a, 9, 1, 2, n/a, n/a, N
Griffons, 1-6, 2-16, 4, 12, fl30, 7, 10, E, N
Halflings, 2-20, 30-120+, 7, 9, 1-1, 70, C, L, N
Hippogriffs, 1-8, 2-16, 6, 18, fl36, 3+1, n/a, n/a, L, N
Hobgoblins, 4-24, 30-300+, 6, 9, 1+1, 30, D, C
Horses, n/a, n/a, 7, --, Various, --, n/a, n/a, N
Hydras, 1, 1-2, --Various, --, 25, B, N
Insects, giant, ----, Various, ----, n/a, n/a, N
Invisible, stalker, 1, n/a, 4, 12, fl12, 8, n/a, n/a, N
Juggernaut, 1, n/a, 0, 12, 37, n/a, n/a, N
Kobolds, 4-24, 40-400+, 7, 6, sw9, 1/2, 50, *, C
Kraken, 1, 1, 1, 3, sw18, 30, 75, A3, H, N
Leeches, giant, 4-16, n/a, 9, 3, sw3, 2+2, n/a, n/a, N
Leviathan, 1, 1, 0, sw21, 45, n/a, n/a, N
Living, statues, iron, 1-4, n/a, -3, 9, 16, n/a, n/a, N
Living, statues, stone, 1-4, n/a, 0, 9, 12, n/a, n/a, N
Lizardmen, 2-12, 10-60+, 6, 9, sw12, 2+1, 40, D, C
Lycanthropes, 2-8, 2-20, ----, Various, ----, Any
Manticoras, 1-4, 1-6, 4, 12, fl18, 6+1, 25, D, C
Medusae, 1, 1-4, 6, 9, 4, 75, F, C
Men, 4-24, 30-300+, ----, Various, ----, Any
Mermen, 4-24, 30-300+, 7, 12, 1+1, 15, A3, N
Minotaurs, 1-4, 1-8, 7, 12, 6, 10, C, C, N,
Mummies, 1-4, 2-12, 3, 9, 5+1, 30, D, C
Nixies, 2-12, 10-100, 7, 9, sw12, 1, 100, B, N
Ochre, jelly, 1, n/a, 9, 3, 5, n/a, n/a, N
Octopi, giant, 1, 1-6, 7, 3, sw12, 8, 70, A3, N
Ogres, 1-4, 3-18, 5, 9, 4+1, 30, C, C, N
Orcs, 2-20, 30-300+, 7, 9, 1, 50, D, C, N
Pegasi, 1-12, n/a, 7, 24, fl48, 2+2, n/a, n/a, L, N
Pixies, 2-12, 10-100, 5, 9, fl12, 1, 25, C, N
Purple, worms, 6, sw6, br6, 15, 25, D, N
Reptiles, ----Various, ----, n/a, n/a, N
Robots, 1-4, n/a, 3, 6, fl6, 7, n/a, n/a, C, N
Rocs, 1-2, 1-20, 4, 6, fl48, 6, 20, I, N
Salamanders, 2-5, 4-14, 3, 9, 7+3, 65, F, C
Sea, serpents, 1-3, n/a, 2, sw24, 15, n/a, n/a, C
Shadows, 1-8, 2-24, 7, 9, 2+2, 50, F, C
Skeletons, 3-30, n/a, 8, 6, 1/2, n/a, n/a, C
Spectres, 1-4, 1-8, 4, 15, fl30, 6, 25, E, C
Squids, giant, 1, 1-3, 7, sw3, 18, 12, 40, A3, N
Thulls, 1-6, 4-24, 6, 9, 3, 35, D, C
Titan, 1, 1, -3, 18, 16+2, 5, A*, Any
Treants, 1-4, 2-20, 2, 6, 8, 50, n/a, L, N
Trolls, 1-4, 2-12, 5, 12, 6+3, 50, D, C
Unicorns, 1-2, 1-6, 4, 24, 4, n/a, n/a, L
Vampires, 1-2, 1-6, 2, 12, fl18, 8, 20, F, C
Wights, 1-8, 2-24, 6, 9, 3, 60, B, C
Wraiths, 1-6, 2-16, 5, 12, fl24, 4, 20, E, C
Wyverns, 1-2, 1-6, 4, 9, fl24, 7, 60, E, C, N
Zombies, 3-30, n/a, 9, 6, 1, n/a, n/a, C


Have at it [No attempt was made to make the data nice just cut and pasted from the PDF then "cat dd_monster.txt | sort"... I alright I did open it vi and swapped spaces for , now it almost opens as a csv ]


-Mike

[Mike]

Please don't think I was just slinging mud here. I LOVE DD. for a wider audience however, switch to plan B.

Did I mention I love DD?

[mgtremaine]

NO worries! Please don;t think I was being snarky, it just occurred to me hey I can easily resort that list. Volia.... Ok so it's not that useful but if someone wanted to they can use it as the basis for a new list. Saved a little typing.

-Mike

[waysoftheearth]

Thanks for the feedback guys, it is appreciated.

I believe John has already hinted that he will be organising the monsters alphabetically in the illustrated version.

In the meanwhile, you may be pleased to know then, that there is an alphabetical index of all monsters (including all the sub-types) in the print version and also the public PDF of vol 3.