Delving Deeper and Sword & Spell

[ahabicher]

Hello!
I have searched the board for an answer, but to no avail, so I venture forth and create a new thread: 
Delving Deeper and Sword & Spell are both newer presentations of Original Dungeons & Dragons. However, there are differences, most notably among the available spells. Otherwise, they widely share the same content. Is there somewhere an overview on how those two games differ from the Original DnD and from each other?
Thank you!

[waysoftheearth]

Hi ahabicher, welcome to the boards.

FWIW, I'm the co-developer of the first versions of DD, and the developer of the later versions of DD.

This is the first I've heard of Sword & Spell, although it seems to have been around for a while? I've just downloaded the first booklet PDF which says 2nd Edition, 3rd Printing, copyright 2019. At first glance (the 2nd Ed/3rd print edition) looks to be a very near cousin to DD indeed. I even wonder if the developer(s) might have used later versions of DD as research inputs--or if we coincidentally managed to arrive at a very similar place on a few things. If they are a member of these boards--or someone knows where they hang out--I'd be interested to hear about their journey.

On the downside S&S is not freely available, but on the upside it's great to see OSR Hobbies are actively developing supporting material for S&S which is more than I can say for myself!

In terms of general comparison, it appears (from a fly though book 1) S&S is:
* Possibly a bit briefer than DD (which might be a positive),
* More identical to the original in some ways (XP and HD progression, the alternative attack matrix 1) which DD intentionally alters for copyright,
* Further from the original in some other ways (e.g., player class and spell descriptions not as detailed, uses "d-notation" rather than number ranges, introduces "legendary" status for superheroes, appears to support the alternative combat system exclusively, etc.);
* Insensitive to certain copyright concerns (e.g., includes "Hobbits", replicates a number of OD&D tables precisely...).

Regards the spell lists, seems to me that S&S duplicates the original spells lists exactly using SRD spell names (and a few inventions where necessary). DD4 (from distant memory) introduced some additional spells. DD5's spell list is closer to the original (and hence S&S), but is still intentionally not identical for copyright. I believe (as the biased author) DD5's spell descriptions are more authentic despite renaming and moving a few of them around.

All quibbles aside, many of the OD&D simulacra are quite similar for obvious reasons. From my quick look at book 1, S&S appears to be one of the better ones.

It's kinda ironic that folks often want to compare different simulacra; they are possibly better viewed as a collective body of work from which the bits and pieces you like most can be assembled into your own unique game.

Hope that helps some

[ahabicher]

Thank you very much!
That sheds a lot of light on the matter.

I have found out about Sword & Spell via their Discord Server "OSR Hobbies", where they also speak about this ODD74 board here, so I imagine they are actively involved here on this forum. Despite their apparently very faithful reiteration of Original DnD the actual games they play there are heavily houseruled so they do not look very much like the Original. Their character creation speaks of Mystic Warriors, Half-Giants and Grimalkin.

I am currently in a game of Delving Deeper on *another* Discord Server called "werdna world", so I was wondering about these two variants, as both of them seem to be much more pleasing to the eye and therefore much easier to learn and teach than the actual original.

Cheers!

[waysoftheearth]

Thanks ahabicher; I'll try to connect with OSR Hobbies on their Discord. Meanwhile, if anyone from OSR Hobbies is active on these boards, sing out.

FYI--I have been lurking on Werdna World since it started. Acodispo was a player in my decade-long Hinterlands game (here), before he started Werdna World. I tried to run Hinterlands as by-the-book as was practical. I also tried to make it educational, with a meta-thread running along side the in game thread.