Sci-Fi vs SF

[Falconer]

Have you guys ever heard, and do you give any credit to the idea, that “serious” science fiction fans consider “SF” to be the true acronym, and “Sci-Fi” to be derogatory?

[derv]

Never heard that one, but it wouldn't surprise me. Funny thing is I tend to use "SF" instead of "Sci-Fi" because I'm lazy, not because I'm hard core.

[strangebrew]

Maybe I should start using "SF" over "Sci-Fi"... whenever I hear "Sci-Fi" now I think of the Syfy channel, which I associate with terrible movies featuring awful actors and horribly computer animated anacondas and crocodiles (probably fighting each other at the anti-climactic climax).

On the other hand, whenever I see or hear "SF" I think of San Francisco. Which might be fitting because it is kind of a world of its own.

[Finarvyn]

Nope. Both the same in my mind. It's SyFy that I hate.

[talysman]

Yep. In particular, Harlan Ellison used to say that before he abandoned "SF", too.

What I also hear is that "serious" people define SF as an abbreviation for "speculative fiction" instead of "science fiction".

[desertscrb]

Yes, and I refer to it as sci-fi because (a) it's a cultural shorthand for the various forms of geeky entertainment that I enjoy, and (b) it pisses people off.

[thorswulf]

I don't know where this junk got started, but if somebody has to defend what they love with "serious" or "mature" terminology, then they are missing the point. Speculative fiction? Give me a break. All fiction IS speculative. Sci fi means science fiction in all of its sub-genres at their best and worst. Thank goodness the network changed it's name. One channel does not a cultural love make. I like to think the late Ray Bradbury and Ray Harryhousen are playing with dinosaurs and rocketships in the here-after. Now if that isn't sci fi I don't know what is!

[coffee]

Aug 24, 2013 9:12:40 GMT -6 Falconer said:

Have you guys ever heard, and do you give any credit to the idea, that “serious” science fiction fans consider “SF” to be the true acronym, and “Sci-Fi” to be derogatory?

I have heard that, and I give total credit to the idea. I was one of those guys. This was back in the late 70's, early 80's. And, yes, it was influenced by Ellison.

The SF guys, like me, were readers. Sure, we'd see all the movies, hoping for something good. We'd had the promise of Star Trek, which showed that you could get good SF on the screen. But in those days, most of it was awful. Hollywood didn't understand SF. (They didn't understand comics, either -- go back and watch any of the 70's era Marvel shows if you don't believe me.) The resulting bastard child of SF and crass commercialism was what we called Sci-Fi. (And, also, there was the connotation of 'kid stuff' in that.)

The SF/Sci-Fi divide gave us a sense of community. We were already on the outside; this way we wouldn't also be alone out there.

But hey, I'm from a very small town. Maybe it was different in cities.

[thorswulf]

One could argue that hollyweird still doesn't get sci fi in some respects.... The bottom line, and special effects to be sure, but not the rest of what makes good science fiction.

[Vile Traveller]

d**n right. Don't gimme none of that Sci-Fi hogwash, dagnabbit! Grrr.

[talysman]

Well, the problem with Hollywood sci-fi (or SF) is that Hollywood is run by people who idolize and fetishize emotion over reason, and who distrust technology and "book larnin'", the same way mainstream America does. So, Hollywood sci-fi tends to be a bit anti-science, sometimes enormously anti-science.

[tkdco2]

Aug 30, 2013 20:36:32 GMT -6 talysman said:

Well, the problem with Hollywood sci-fi (or SF) is that Hollywood is run by people who idolize and fetishize emotion over reason, and who distrust technology and "book larnin'", the same way mainstream America does. So, Hollywood sci-fi tends to be a bit anti-science, sometimes enormously anti-science.

And a lot of gamers only play in the settings taken from Hollywood. A lot of starship miniatures and games produced are from Star Trek, Star Wars, etc. Not that I find anything wrong with them, but those are other people's sandboxes; I prefer to make my own.

Besides, there's more to SF than those shows. What's wrong with something different? I once posted a rant on another board expressing my frustration at some of my players not willing to try something new.

By the way, I use both sci-fi and SF. I often prefer the latter when posting because I'm lazy!

[talysman]

Apr 11, 2015 2:59:51 GMT -6 tkdco2 said:

Aug 30, 2013 20:36:32 GMT -6 talysman said:

Well, the problem with Hollywood sci-fi (or SF) is that Hollywood is run by people who idolize and fetishize emotion over reason, and who distrust technology and "book larnin'", the same way mainstream America does. So, Hollywood sci-fi tends to be a bit anti-science, sometimes enormously anti-science.

And a lot of gamers only play in the settings taken from Hollywood. A lot of starship miniatures and games produced are from Star Trek, Star Wars, etc. Not that I find anything wrong with them, but those are other people's sandboxes; I prefer to make my own.

Besides, there's more to SF than those shows. What's wrong with something different? I once posted a rant on another board expressing my frustration at some of my players not willing to try something new.

By the way, I use both sci-fi and SF. I often prefer the latter when posting because I'm lazy!

I see no problem with people playing in Star Trek's setting, at least in a TOS-based setting (or Geoffrey's Rand Canon.) Star Trek: TOS stands out as being one of the few Hollywood sci-fi products that isn't anti-science.

Can't help you with getting people to try something new,though. To a certain extent, I feel it doesn't matter. I would prefer that they try something not Star Wars or Star Wars-esque. Something with a smaller feel, a sort of "interstellar points of light", rather than space empires and mystical star knights.

[geoffrey]

C. S. Lewis (and I'm sure others) used to call it "scientifiction".

[thorswulf]

Maybe we need to call it just fiction. Science is more gonzo than fiction could ever hope to be!Nomenclature being what it is, and the fact labels create divisions, maybe it's all just hawgwash....

[Torreny]

The way I see it, is it's Conan, whether it's Howard or Carter. One just tends to read better.

[Malcadon]

Whenever I use "SF", it in usually in reference to the Star Frontiers role-playing game. Otherwise, I'm accustomed to seeing "sci-fi" used for science fiction since childhood, so I use that term a lot.