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Post by Otto Harkaman on Sept 13, 2012 15:16:30 GMT -6
I got a strange hankering to reread Harold Lamb's "Alexander the Great"  It also got me to thinking that one of the early wargames I owned was Avalon Hill's "Alexander the Great." Tripped me out finding out that this was one of Gary's first published games.    www.boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/1726/alexander-the-greatAnybody else ever played this? |
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Post by owlorbs on Sept 14, 2012 22:43:46 GMT -6
Another old classic I acquired and read but sadly have not played (AH version). It has some fascinating stuff, like the multiple defense factors, the different sized and shaped counters, and the sliding morale track. A solid game for 1971 as far as I can tell. I see there is a Vassal mod.
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Post by Otto Harkaman on Sept 14, 2012 22:56:43 GMT -6
Fun reading this old Harold Lamb book on Alexander, looks like it was published in 1946. Lamb got his start writing for a lot of the pulp magazines. I think he was a favorite of Robert E. Howard.
I think as I've gotten older I have more and more respect for Philip II, Alexander's father. There is no way Alexander could have done what he did without Philip's accomplishments. Olympias, Alexander's mother, is a very fascinating character. I think the rumors were true that they both were central to the plot to assassinate Philip. He had divorced her and if he would have birth another son with his new bride would have declared him his heir I believe.
I wish I could find the rules to this old board game, the vassal module looks well done. For such a simple game it seems pretty complex with the morale and multiple defense as you stated.
Oh do you still have this game owlorbs? As I said it was one of the first games I owned but sadly long lost in some move or other catastrophe.
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Post by Otto Harkaman on Sept 15, 2012 7:58:39 GMT -6
I was wondering how much influence Gary's development of this might have affected his development of Chainmail?
The whole morale thing is interesting since its essential to both games.
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Post by owlorbs on Sept 15, 2012 10:08:07 GMT -6
I still have a nice copy that needs playing. I'll see if I can track down a rules copy. This game also has an extremely rare expansion that would be fun to find.
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Post by Otto Harkaman on Sept 15, 2012 13:29:06 GMT -6
Yes I saw the expansion on boardgamegeeks, "Alexander's Other Battles."  boardgamegeek.com/boardgameexpansion/15207/alexanders-other-battlesWe would be extremely lucky to find that! I do have digital copies of all the AH Generals, I've extracted a couple of the articles that looked the most interesting. There is a good replay in V14 and how to win playing Darius in V18. |
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Post by Sean Michael Kelly on Sept 15, 2012 13:31:09 GMT -6
Yes I saw the expansion on boardgamegeeks, "Alexander's Other Battles." boardgamegeek.com/boardgameexpansion/15207/alexanders-other-battlesWe would be extremely lucky to find that! I do have digital copies of all the AH Generals, I've extracted a couple of the articles that looked the most interesting. There is a good replay in V14 and how to win playing Darius in V18. Ooooo..... Shiny. Gamer porn. |
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Post by Otto Harkaman on Sept 15, 2012 13:33:08 GMT -6
LOL true ;D
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Post by Otto Harkaman on Sept 15, 2012 13:39:38 GMT -6
I was able to find the 1956 version of "Alexander the Great"  Going to be my late Saturday afternoon matinee  |
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Post by Otto Harkaman on Sept 17, 2012 8:30:13 GMT -6
I am just totally enjoying this Harold Lamb book on Alexander, just fought the battle of Granicus. Alexander sounds totally crazy, I don't think he would have won against another first rate general with a solid loyal army at his back. His uncle I believe Alexander of Epirus was soundly thrashed by the Romans around the same time. I doubt Alexander would have done any better against them.
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Post by owlorbs on Sept 17, 2012 9:53:30 GMT -6
I was inspired by your post to get a copy of the book in hopes my daughter might read it (she seems interested). I have several games on Alexander so I could get some good mileage out of the book. Of course, I'm sure I'll enjoy it as well.
I also have a copy of "Alexander the Great at War: His Army - His Battles - His Enemies" which has some great visuals.
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Post by Otto Harkaman on Sept 17, 2012 10:52:58 GMT -6
Lamb's books are classics, he was very popular in his day. I think Cecil B. Demille used him as a consultant on a couple of his movies. I think you will really enjoy it. I had forgotten about the great men that were contemporaries of Alexander and that Aristotle had been his tutor. Currently I am marching with him down the coast of Asia Minor into what then was called Lydia.  |
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Post by Otto Harkaman on Sept 18, 2012 7:14:54 GMT -6
It is wild to think that the mole that Alexander had his engineer Deiades build to besiege Tyre is still there! And for how long the Phoenicians had ruled the trade routes in the ancient world, hundreds of years, wow!  Fascinating to read this ancient history with what is going on in the world right now. |
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Post by Finarvyn on Sept 18, 2012 17:10:11 GMT -6
I have this book called The Mask of Command by John Keegan. In it he examines the lives of four key commanders in world history. The main sections of the book are titled:
(1) Alexander the Great adn Heroic Leadership
(2) Wellington: the Anti-Hero
(3) Grant and Unheroic Leadership
(4) False Heroic: Hitler as Supreme Commander
It's been decades since I read it, but have fond memories of the Alexander section in particular.
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Post by Otto Harkaman on Sept 18, 2012 18:11:01 GMT -6
Oh I have enjoyed several of John Keegan's books but I don't think I have read The Mask of Command. I really enjoyed his Face of Battle and I've poked a little bit into the book he did on the American Revolution.
This Harold Lamb book changes from a historical novel to a character analysis of Alexander after he crosses into Asia Minor. I'll have to find Mask of Command Finarvyn and see what Keegan has to say of Alexander.
Alexander seemed crazy at the battle of Chaeronea and Granicus but starts to show more tactical sense at Issus. I am amazed they were able to pull off Gaugamela where Alexander really showed a more cooler head in the whole matter (at least by Lamb).
I was thinking of Crassus's defeat and was intrigued that there isn't much mention of arrows that so decimated the Romans.
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Post by Otto Harkaman on Sept 19, 2012 3:24:49 GMT -6
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Post by Otto Harkaman on Sept 19, 2012 4:44:21 GMT -6
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Post by Finarvyn on Sept 19, 2012 7:24:26 GMT -6
If you get it, maybe you can share it with us!  |
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Post by Otto Harkaman on Sept 19, 2012 7:29:54 GMT -6
Actually now that I think about it, I can't think of any battle off hand that achieved Alexander's economy of force and penetration tactics. I thought perhaps General Schwarzkopf's Desert Storm. Now that I look at it maybe some small penetrations in the front but mainly a flanking envelopment.  Anybody know of such battle? Ah I had to do a search and came up with some of Frederick the Great's battles. |
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Post by Otto Harkaman on Sept 19, 2012 20:26:52 GMT -6
Well I am a bit surprised but I can not find any battle that accurately copies Alexander's tactic of creating a breach in a off center part of an enemy's battle line then launching an elite attacking force through to attack the enemy's rear or critical command center.
Maybe von Manstein's plan for the battle of France?
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Post by Otto Harkaman on Sept 19, 2012 21:09:18 GMT -6
Philip's battle plan of Chaeronea where Alexander prematurely launched his attack is really interesting me. Intuitively I feel it shows more mastery than Issus and Gaugamela. I think it shows how to inflict greater casualties on an enemy force by attacking an exposed flank and what is better in this case is an exposed flank in the center of an enemies battle line, instead of on a wing of an enemy army.
Alexander's premature attack led to a lot of unnecessary Macedonian casualties. Lucky for for Alexander's impetuosity he was able to go after the critical command center of Darius's person at Issus and Gaugamela. Philip had no such easy target at Chaeronea. But I have to add Philip wasn't faced with hordes of asiatic horse archers that could enevlopement him at any moment.
I really don't know how Parmenio was able to hold the left flank against the Great King's horsemen. One of those things you wish you could witness in real action I suppose. Again thinking of Crassus were are those decimating arrows along with wagons, horses and mules carrying ammunition resupplies?
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Post by Otto Harkaman on Sept 20, 2012 5:57:07 GMT -6
This battle plan of Issus is from Lamb's book on Alexander. I think it shows better how Alexander was covering his elite attack force, the Hypaspists and Companion cavalry. Then once contact was made using it to create a penetration. I guess its easy to forget how skilled these guys were.  |
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Post by Otto Harkaman on Sept 20, 2012 7:24:56 GMT -6
I guess its also hard to imagine what these men were like, they were tough, tougher then any people we normally encounter and they had personally killed a lot of people. |
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Post by Otto Harkaman on Sept 21, 2012 1:55:52 GMT -6
Woah!! This looks like a really dangerous stunt, I can't beleive they actually put sickles on these chariots for the movie of Alexander done in 1956. Animated gif of charging chariots at bottom of picture.  Here is an animated gif of the scene, its pretty cool but large file www.lexweb.us/alexander/chariots.gifInstead of attacking infantry with them, I think they would be devastating against cavalry. At the very least they would break up the cavalry formation. |
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