Dark Dungeons

[Aplus]

Dark Dungeons is a game I hear little about. This is the first "retro-clone" I came across, and I have the PDF (I can't stand reading PDFs). I am interested in getting a hard copy of either this or the Rules Cyclopedia. I would be buying the Rules Cyclopedia blindly, and it costs a bit, so I'd like to make an informed decision.

I guess the question I have is why people speak so highly of the RC, but Dark Dungeons hasn't seemed to capture the audience I would expect, just by virtue of it's being a RC clone. Does it fail to capture the spirit of the RC?

Any input from anyone with experience with either of these books is appreciated.

[thegreyelf]

I think the problem with Dark Dungeons is twofold:

First, it came very late in the game--a ton of retro-clones had already been done by that point, and Labyrinth Lord is so close in form and feel to basic D&D that it became largely unnecessary (especially considering how close B/X and BE are).

Second, the author of Dark Dungeons has repeatedly and continually thumbed his nose at and expressed disdain and vitriol for the old-school community (specifically those who identify as part of the so-called "renaissance".) Hating your core target audience is rarely a good idea when publishing a game.

That being said, if you want a collected version of BECMI D&D, the Rules Cyclopedia is still the best way to go. It's affordable on ebay (and sometimes the Amazon Marketplace) and Dave Arneson on these very forums called it his personal ultimate version of Dungeons & Dragons. You can't get a higher recommendation than that.

The RC is a beautiful book, well-written, clear, and excellently organized. It really is a great version of BECM D&D.

[Aplus]

Thanks for your input. I have a $30 bid in for a copy of the RC right now.

*keeps fingers crossed*

[bluskreem]

Stylistically there are some things about DD that bug some people. Unlike the RC nothing is presented as optional, which has caused a few grumbles (although i don't really see why.) The three column layout is a little hard to read, and the font is a tad light. Dark Dungeons also uses Public Domain art, which bugs some people, buit with all the complaints about RC's art I'm not sure it's a deciding factor.

Personally I like Dark Dungeons, but I've gotten so much use out of my RC I'm more comfortable with it. My softcover is usually on the table during LL play.

[thegreyelf]

There is a softcover of the RC??

[bluskreem]

Oops, i meant I still keep my softcover Dark Dungeons at the table when i play LL. The RC is there too, however.

[Mr. Darke]

I had the pdf for awhile but deleted it. In all honesty, I just didn't like it. I don't know why and I can't put my finger on any one thing that stands out as bad or as a real reason not to like it. So take my comment for what it's worth.

Personally I would go with the RC or get one of the S&W sets that are out there.

[Aplus]

Yes, I have a S&W White Box on the way as well. I am basically looking to cherry-pick content from one source to paste into my S&W game. It seems like the RC is the most suitable book for this. For example, I prefer the ability score bonuses as presented in BECM.

[thegreyelf]

Oh, heck, if I'd known that's what you were after...

...Labyrinth Lord + Original Edition Characters + Advanced Edition Companion is your ultimate best bet. TONS of stuff you can cherry pick for S&W: WB.

[Web Warlock]

While I own, play and enjoy every edition of D&D out now, I have a particular fondess for the RC as well.

It is just so well put together and the best "one book" D&D I know of.

Tim