How to "sell" Barsoom?

[Finarvyn]

So I cut my teeth on Barsoom going back to my early OD&D days, and my high school buddies are the same way. We read the books, we played all sorts of games on Barsoom, we did OD&D-Barsoom crossovers. I picked up the new 2d20 John Carter game and it's been getting me thinking about Barsoom again. The problem is that my current crew has no knowledge of the setting, with the possible exception that they may have seen the 2012 movie.

(1) How do I "sell" Barsoom?

Many of the stories in the books focus around a "rescue the Princess" vibe, but my group is half female and this won't be as much of a motivating factor for them.

(2) Any ideas for cheap props?

Back in the day I had a bunch of stuff to run a decent Barsoom campaign, but much of that stuff seems to have gotten misplaced in one move or another and at the moment I cannot find a lot of it. I don't have the new $300+ miniatures line, and don't anticipate buying them in the near future. What would be the best source for miniatures (cardboard cutout or otherwise) and other props for the game? What about for airships? Tharks don't look much like anything I have at the moment.

Seems to me like most D&D campaigns are generic medieval fantasy and I have a lot of battlemats for those, but Barsoom has a different look. I think I have some Dark Sun stuff that might work for landscapes. Maybe something Egyptian? I have to dig into some old boxes to see what surfaces.

Basically, I'd like some ideas on how I can put together something visual and clearly Barsoom in a hurry and on a budget.

[Deleted]

Have them read Princess of Mars, Chessmen, and Thuvia. They are short books.

[Vile Traveller]

1) If you're looking for something less combat-oriented (for Barsoom, that is!), how about a spy game? Cold war between city states. You'll have to allow thieves, of course. Maybe an entire party of thieves.

2) Going by Frazetta's art I see Barsoom more as a science fantasy Arabian Nights.

[geoffrey]

I would print-out in full color all of Michael Whelan's Barsoom art. You could probably do it for about $12. Check it out:
www.dragonsfoot.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=26244

Short of reading the books, nothing gets me in the mood for Barsoom as much as Whelan's Barsoom art.

[Malcadon]

Yeah, nowadays "Barsoom" is a bit of a hard-sell. Not just with the way it presents woman, but also the whole "White Savior" angle (I mean, can you imagine a Tribesman from Na'vi getting teleported to Earth, somehow becoming the President, and somehow still, solve our political and economic problems?) Even the writers of the John Carter film know that it would not be an attractive setting unless woman are allowed to fight equal to men. There is also the issue of there being wide-spread use of swords and daggers despite that everyone own and maintain firearms. (Holtzman shields, anyone?)

It goes without saying that the "cheesecake" and cultural nudity aspect of the setting is not appealing to everyone, thus the lack of it in the film (which was no less a huge mistake on their part). Believe it or not, not all woman are innately adverse to this, but are more annoyed to how one-sided it is. I mean, a number of women I know do not hate Red Sonya for the "chain-mail bikini", but for her "problematic" backstory, which implies that should could not become mighty by her own drives, but by a gang of nasty men, and the way she can only be with a man who can best her in combat by some strange stipulation, which robs her of their own sexual agency. Although, the "chain-mail bikini" thing is more to do with how only the men get armor with normal coverage. (..or a lack of men in the sexy armor? LOL) With the nudity in Barsoom, you might have to present the people as being vary comfortable with the human body. State it in a way were they do not affiliate nudity with sexuality and do not act "perverted" over such things, much like Japan before the Dutch came along. If it is handle maturely and not done obtusely (i.e. not like a 13 year old boy) than the players would likely handle it well.

All I can say is to "sell" the setting as an ancient, alien culture. You can emphasize the art, entertainment, props & costumes, and customs. As well as telling them that the setting full of advanced technology, but people are too content and technologically stagnant to be innovative. It would be a good mix of action and adventure, but with deep would-building. (Although, if you are going into would-building in ways that goes beyond ERB's original vision, which is inevitable, Tekumel is a deep vain of ideas you can mine from; just give things a Barsoomian flavor.) If you want to have them play Earthling, use them long enough to better introduce them to the setting as outsiders then have them play Barsoomians as soon as they can.

[Deleted]

Or you could play the game and not overthink everything to death.

[Deleted]

Jun 7, 2019 17:53:26 GMT -6 @gronanofsimmerya said:

Or you could play the game and not overthink everything to death.

Or, we could transform you into a Woola.

[Finarvyn]

Jun 7, 2019 16:13:40 GMT -6 Malcadon said:

All I can say is to "sell" the setting as an ancient, alien culture. You can emphasize the art, entertainment, props & costumes, and customs. As well as telling them that the setting full of advanced technology, but people are too content and technologically stagnant to be innovative.

All good points. I just have to be careful that the term "alien" doesn't invoke thoughts of E.T. or Mars Attacks.

Jun 7, 2019 17:53:26 GMT -6 @gronanofsimmerya said:

Or you could play the game and not overthink everything to death.

Well, I'm trying not to overthink anything. I think my fundamental issue comes from the fact that my group reads a lot of fantasy, yet has no interest in reading the books I like the best -- Burroughs, Leibler, Howard, and so on. So while my high school group already had a knowledge base for my campaigns, my current crew has very little.

And, hey, isn't discussion and overthinking the reason we're here in the first place?

[Deleted]

So, as I said above, have them read two or three of the books. At least a couple of them are now public domain, and they only take a couple hours to read.

If you can't drum up enough interest for the players to read a couple quick little potboilers, give up.

[geoffrey]

Jun 8, 2019 15:38:54 GMT -6 @gronanofsimmerya said:

So, as I said above, have them read two or three of the books. At least a couple of them are now public domain, and they only take a couple hours to read.

If you can't drum up enough interest for the players to read a couple quick little potboilers, give up.

Even though I gave my players a week to read a 100-word background, not a single one read it. (My favorite was the one who gravely shook his head and said, "I didn't have time.")

I indeed gave up. I've never since asked my players to read anything.

[kipper]

B... A... R... S...

Oh, wait.

[Deleted]

Try the line of miniatures from Bronze Age miniatures. Less expensive, and much better figures. Terrain from various companies, including the local big-box pet stores; easy to do, as your Mysterious Ancient Ruins tend to look like terrarium and aquarium decor - including the rock formations with the caves that the players wake up in. Flyers can start out as foam core cut-outs and move up to plywood, like my two ships ('Keri' & 'Zhodi', named after Fourth Daughter and First Son-in-law). Adventures are also pretty easy, as the ERB tent is big enough to handle just about anything. I can run them off the top of my head, and I don't think I'm anything special.

Don't beat the gender horse to death. My friends the Shieldmaidens play Barsoomian warrior women with no problems. And they like the figures, too.

And let your players know that Barsoom is not fantasy. It's 'Sword and Planet Romance', just like Tekumel is. And ya know, it's a funny old thing; I get a lot of folks wanting to try that genre, and they read the books and play in my games. This coming weekend, I'm looking at over thirty players over the course of the day, all there for swords, spaceships, ray guns, and birthday cake.

[Deleted]

Jun 6, 2019 9:37:54 GMT -6 Finarvyn said:

Many of the stories in the books focus around a "rescue the Princess" vibe, but my group is half female and this won't be as much of a motivating factor for them.

Jun 8, 2019 5:04:56 GMT -6 Finarvyn said:

I think my fundamental issue comes from the fact that my group reads a lot of fantasy, yet has no interest in reading the books I like the best -- Burroughs, Leibler, Howard, and so on.

At what point do you realize that Barsoom just isn't a good fit for your group? Grab Peril on the Purple Planet and add some Barsoomy stuff to that.

[scottenkainen]

Jun 8, 2019 20:45:06 GMT -6 geoffrey said:

Even though I gave my players a week to read a 100-word background, not a single one read it. (My favorite was the one who gravely shook his head and said, "I didn't have time.")

That is shocking beyond words. What the heck, people...?

[Deleted]

They are clearly saying "I'm not interested."

[geoffrey]

Exactly. That's why I stopped writing that sort of thing. My players simply aren't interested in it.

[derv]

Jun 6, 2019 9:37:54 GMT -6 Finarvyn said:

(1) How do I "sell" Barsoom?

Many of the stories in the books focus around a "rescue the Princess" vibe, but my group is half female and this won't be as much of a motivating factor for them.

Do they need to know the setting? I'd just give them a generic overview and let the game unfold. Honestly, I think Carter's work is a hard sell for many of today's generation. Even if they're readers they may look at them as old books not worth investing in.

If it was me I'd try to get them invested by running a kick-a** session first. Give them some pre-gens. Throw in what you consider the best of Barsoom. I'm thinking some air ships and white apes might be involved. Maybe a find your way home type mission.

Perhaps they'll end up reading one of Carter's stories as a consequence and want more.

[doublejig2]

You could try reworking the 100 word background into a 140 character tweet. They might read that.

[tdenmark]

Jun 6, 2019 10:53:51 GMT -6 @gronanofsimmerya said:

Have them read Princess of Mars, Chessmen, and Thuvia. They are short books.

Not just short, but they are real page turners. There is a reason Burroughs was the king of pulp.

[Deleted]

Jun 12, 2019 12:20:13 GMT -6 Piper said:

So what's wrong with adapting the elements you like while eliminating that which you do not? I've played in, and run a few, entertaining one-shots and campaigns (mini- or otherwise) based around such beginnings.

There are two ways to go: Set the game in Barsoom and painstakingly remove the objectionable parts, or, as I suggested, take a gaming setting that's similar and add the good Barsoomian parts to that.

The reason I suggested the latter is that it avoids any negative connotations associated with the prime IP and, thus, is more easily accepted.

[Deleted]

Jun 13, 2019 15:50:53 GMT -6 Piper said:

In the long run, however, I'd have to concede your approach is likely the better way. Radium pistols? Heck, no! These are darium pistols, very deadly. Mars/Barsoom? No way ... this is Moobars (and so on ... you get the general idea).

Considering how little the players actually know about the John Carter books, he should be able to import monsters, characters, and plots straight from the books and his players will never even notice.

[dicebro]

How about not selling it.... just teleporting the party to an alien world where they immediately risk getting eaten by 10 legged, green-eyed lions might get them interested real fast.

[artikid]

I'd describe the game as more intrigue, romance, chases, exploration and (some) duels.
And since half your party is made up by woman you could reverse the Carter stereotype to "save the prince".
And since Barsoom history is almost completely forgotten, you can make up things: other forgotten gods than Issus, weird science buried in the ruins of forgotten city-states, and so on...

[hamurai]

A little late to the discussion, but I've had a similar thing just some weeks ago, so I thought I might add it for further inspiration

My group also wasn't interested in any "swords & planet"-type of game (we were playing a mini-campaign of DCC), but said they liked the weird and dark fantasy and the sci-fi elements of the implied setting of the DCC modules we had played.
I wanted to run some games on the Purple Planet, so I let them discover a means to travel to "some other world", but they had to work for it. That got their interest and they eventually got the pathway open, teleporting them to a dungeon on the Purple Planet. They got to know some monsters of this world and met some NPCs who fed them only bits of information, enough to pique their interest.
When they finally got out of the dungeon they were invested enough in the story and had grown into the setting enough. I ran an adventure on the Purple Planet which basically allowed them to go back to their own world, but they got to choose when. The group decided to stay for a while.

So maybe instead of putting the players into a setting, let them grow into it with the characters they already play (if those could fit into the setting).