idrahil
Level 6 Magician
The Lighter The Rules, The Better The Game!
Posts: 398
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Post by idrahil on Oct 6, 2015 19:26:48 GMT -6
Hey everyone...can anyone point me towards a good (or favorite) book regarding the history of war gaming? There are so many choices out there. I'm doing this for my senior thesis so I want to find a few sources that are favored by people in the know.
Thanks!
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Post by howandwhy99 on Oct 6, 2015 20:47:36 GMT -6
Something by Jim Dunnigan probably. Wargame Design: The History, Production and Use of Conflict Simulations, Simulations Publications, 1977 is older, but right in line with the era of D&D game design thinking. EDIT: The Complete Wargames Handbook: How to Play, Design and Find Them, Revised edition, William Morrow, 1992 This is more up-to-date, but isn't a historical work. I haven't more than paged through it, but it's well regarded.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 6, 2015 20:49:44 GMT -6
"Playing at the World." It's the best history of wargaming from the 16th to the 19th century I've read.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 7, 2015 0:48:23 GMT -6
Jepp, Jon Peterson is pretty lonely at the top of research in the field, and "Playing at the World", while not all-encompasing, is probably the seminal work in his area of research. In addition, I found this bibliographical timeline extremely useful for my own (albeit non-academic) pursuits: www-personal.umich.edu/~beattie/timeline2.html
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 7, 2015 3:20:33 GMT -6
Oh, and, for the first time in a long while, *mod hat on*, as a preventive measure:
Please, folks, we know that some were not satisfied or, rather than that, not personally okay with some of the more modern findings on gaming history. Some for valid reasons, some not. In both cases, please let's keep that out of here for now.
To add something on the topic, though, apparently a group of Tolkien fans orchestrated the first fantasy conventions in New York in the late 50s, and early 60s.- This was a precursor to the Tolkien Society, and associated with what later would become the American Tolkien Society. (From what I understand, two different entities.) --- But, for the life of me, I don't remember the name of the New York group.
The interesting detail about that New York group was that they apparently tried to recreate the Tolkienian battles with miniatures - and that apparently made them the first organized fantasy war gamers. - But more details, I simply don't remember.
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Post by ritt on Oct 7, 2015 15:50:18 GMT -6
"Playing at the World." It's the best history of wargaming from the 16th to the 19th century I've read. Ditto. It's an incredible work and pretty much essential reading.
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idrahil
Level 6 Magician
The Lighter The Rules, The Better The Game!
Posts: 398
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Post by idrahil on Oct 7, 2015 16:51:05 GMT -6
Thanks for the input everyone. I really appreciate it. There was just so many books on the subject and I don't want to get bogged down sifting through them all.
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Post by derv on Oct 7, 2015 17:07:42 GMT -6
Peter P. Perla, The Art of Wargaming, 1990 An in depth look at both hobby and professional wargaming and their influences. Here's an article he wrote for the Naval War College Review that you might find useful. Henry Hyde, The Wargaming Compendium, 2009 I recommend this book not because of it's academic usefulness, but more because of it's aesthetic beauty and it's joy to read. It does give a history to wargaming, most of which you will have read else where in more depth. But, the book is littered with high quality illustrations and photos. The book does also contain a number of useful references. For an overall "guide book" to the hobby, this is a must read. Henry Hyde is the editor of the UK magazine Miniature Wargames. There is also John Curry's History of Wargaming Project that has published an ongoing series called Wargaming Pioneers. Currently, there are six volumes that reproduce some of the earliest rule sets of modern wargaming. I also echo the other endorsements of Jon Peterson's Playing at the World.
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Post by kesher on Oct 8, 2015 11:32:45 GMT -6
I'll, like, 6th Playing at the World, and 2nd The Wargaming Compendium!
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Post by jmccann on Oct 8, 2015 21:25:20 GMT -6
Dupuy's Numbers Prediction and War is interesting, and also dates to the period of OD&D (pub. 1979) www.amazon.com/Numbers-prediction-war-history-evaluate/dp/0672521318The Perla book is largely overshadowed by Peterson but has some material regarding naval wargames that Peterson does not include. Peterson is by far the most informative for the period leading up to OD&D.
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Post by Otto Harkaman on Oct 11, 2015 20:16:25 GMT -6
Thanks for the recommendation going to have a look at "Playing at the World"
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Post by Otto Harkaman on Oct 23, 2015 19:51:33 GMT -6
I've been having fun reading "Playing at the World" really interesting information!
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Post by increment on Oct 25, 2015 22:28:05 GMT -6
To add something on the topic, though, apparently a group of Tolkien fans orchestrated the first fantasy conventions in New York in the late 50s, and early 60s.- This was a precursor to the Tolkien Society, and associated with what later would become the American Tolkien Society. (From what I understand, two different entities.) --- But, for the life of me, I don't remember the name of the New York group. The interesting detail about that New York group was that they apparently tried to recreate the Tolkienian battles with miniatures - and that apparently made them the first organized fantasy war gamers. - But more details, I simply don't remember. I'm sure Tony Bath, were he still with us, would be nudging this thread about his "Tolkia" games in the late 1950s, to say nothing of his Hyboria games in the same era. Early Tolkien fandom in America has a number of interesting structural ties to wargaming, though I'd be surprised to find any evidence of them prior to the 1960s. If you're thinking of, say, the Neo-Numenorians (not a New York group), that would be late 1960s even. Those groups had structural connections to the War Game Inventors Guild and other activities that Gary Gygax was directly involved in. But if you're thinking of something else, do remember.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 26, 2015 0:38:36 GMT -6
Hey, Jon! Glad to see you're around! Okay, so the story is, back in '11, a buddy and I were collecting information on a project similar to your book - though we never made through the beginning stages, really. It was during that preliminary research that I stumbled across a few references to aforementioned New York group. Now, mind you, those were or- or two-sentence references, and likely as equivocal as any statements of that length. The gist is again that the group was later incorporated into the American Tolkien Society (though I'm not sure if that in fact alludes to the ATS that was founded in '75, or to another, defunct group of the same name). If the group came from wargaming, or from literary studies, I don't know, but from what I recall, it was more on the literary side (as that is where I started my research, and how I found it). "Fellowship of the Ring" was, IIRC, released in July of '54, and Wikipedia states that Allen & Unwin "exported" new editions of "The Hobbit" in '53, '54, and '55. (Whatever "exported" really means here.) Perhaps, the game/replay/presentation was held at a promotional event? - If no records exist, perhaps it was simply a model assembly of how the troop movements could have been - if there's any truth to the story, at all? My impression of the Tolkien research and fandom is that the different groups and movements were historically pretty divided, even competing with each other, so many important records might be lost. However, if it was indeed a Tolkien group that essentially established fantasy wargaming, I figure it would be a way bigger deal. My research notes are still in Spain, and I am located in Germany right now; but whenever I get there, I will look up the details. I assure you, though, this is not a mistake: The quuote I copied back then clearly stated that it was New York, that it were the '50s, and that it were wargaming events.
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