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Post by bestialwarlust on Jul 30, 2015 14:51:12 GMT -6
So do you play your dragons to make them dangerous? Given the lower damage/hp/ac levels of od&d how do you set up your dragon's homes? Maybe a black has pools of acid that it's crafted over time to knock would be treasure hunters in? or a white that has his hoard in the center of the cavern, but the area around contains a drop to icy spikes below-- the pitfall itself is covered in a thin sheen of ice that would send a party tumbling down.
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Post by cooper on Jul 30, 2015 15:00:03 GMT -6
check the # appearing.
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Post by Punkrabbitt on Jul 30, 2015 16:51:26 GMT -6
Minions comprised of Tucker's kobolds.
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Post by Red Baron on Jul 30, 2015 23:36:05 GMT -6
Fly them around in the air and bathe the ground in lethal fire. In the woods, a dragon could even trap even a much larger force, by surrounding them in fire waiting for it to burn inwards and kill everyone.
Spell-using dragons cast anti-magic shell to ward off magic-user disintegrates/charm monsters, protection from normal missiles to block arrows (if your dragons aren't already immune to non-enchanted arrows), and dispel magic to take down fighting-men using a fly spell. Chaotic dragons unfortunately cannot use magic jar spells, and lawful ones would not as they would probably view it as a chaotic spell.
Dragons try to acquire anti-charming items to prevent use of potions of dragon control and charm monster spells.
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Post by Finarvyn on Jul 31, 2015 4:48:08 GMT -6
You could steal an idea from 5E where dragons are "legendary," which means they get to cheat and break the rules. They get extra attacks following a PC's turn, extra moves, that kind of thing. If you assume that dragons get to live a long time, they aren't going to be a pushover.
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Post by chicagowiz on Jul 31, 2015 9:02:03 GMT -6
Dragons fly - and they most likely have allies. I would have them play by the rules, but as ruthlessly as possible. Players wake up and take notice when something starts slinging high powered spells and AoE spells.
Have the dragons fight in situations and places that fit *their* capabilities. A dragon isn't going to stupidly walk into a small room, or in a situation that takes away from its advantages.
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Post by kenmeister on Aug 13, 2015 4:22:40 GMT -6
You could steal an idea from 5E where dragons are "legendary," which means they get to cheat and break the rules. They get extra attacks following a PC's turn, extra moves, that kind of thing. If you assume that dragons get to live a long time, they aren't going to be a pushover. Ah, I see exception-based design is still the watchword ... When you say make OD&D dragons dangerous, are you talking white box ones, or even Greyhawk ones? |
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Post by bestialwarlust on Aug 13, 2015 10:30:20 GMT -6
You could steal an idea from 5E where dragons are "legendary," which means they get to cheat and break the rules. They get extra attacks following a PC's turn, extra moves, that kind of thing. If you assume that dragons get to live a long time, they aren't going to be a pushover. Ah, I see exception-based design is still the watchword ... When you say make OD&D dragons dangerous, are you talking white box ones, or even Greyhawk ones? Just white box dragons. |
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Post by scottenkainen on Aug 13, 2015 12:39:31 GMT -6
I long ago gave up the dragon inflation game. Isn't it more fun to meet a dragon you have a chance of beating than some invincible dragon you don't have a chance against?
~Scott "-enkainen" Casper
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Post by bestialwarlust on Aug 13, 2015 13:51:11 GMT -6
I long ago gave up the dragon inflation game. Isn't it more fun to meet a dragon you have a chance of beating than some invincible dragon you don't have a chance against? ~Scott "-enkainen" Casper Agreed. This is one of the challenges I like about the white box OD&D dragons. They are strong opponents, but combined that with smart play and good tactics makes them even more dangerous. Plus if the pc's defeat a dragon that is played smarter rather than just beating a number inflation game should give them a better feeling of accomplishment. |
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EdOWar
Level 5 Thaumaturgist
Posts: 315
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Post by EdOWar on Aug 13, 2015 14:15:22 GMT -6
What are some suggestions for playing dragons more intelligently? For most GM's, it's easier to inflate numbers to increase the challenge than it is to come up with a smarter way to play the dragon.
Or another way of looking at it, you have one GM matching wits (through the dragon) against multiple (hopefully) intelligent players. It stands to reason the players should come up with more clever ideas than the GM, ideas the typical GM probably won't anticipate, which an ancient dragon could conceivably anticipate. Do you cheat a little, to reflect the dragon's greater wisdom and experience? And I'm not talking about cheating on dice rolls here.
Because if it just comes down to a stand-up fight against a typical party of adventurers, the dragon is toast.
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Post by scottyg on Aug 13, 2015 14:42:22 GMT -6
OD&D dragons don't need to be handled any differently than other monsters. You give them their due, but you should do that with every monster. There's always been this push to make dragons into super beasts. They're not. They can be encountered fairly early in a dungeon. If you're not happy with that default concept of dragons, then make Smaug, but you'd be better off starting from scratch with the intention of making Smaug, and not stretching out the as-is dragons into the chiefest and greatest calamities of the campaign.
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Post by Vile Traveller on Aug 13, 2015 23:21:24 GMT -6
I've always liked ubiquitous, mid-powered dragons in D&D. I see them as relatively common when young with a high mortality rate, so not many make it to great age. They are still a much bigger threat to a small community than, say, a man-eating tiger, but they can be handled by adventurers that are not quite heroes yet.
Their intelligence makes them more dangerous than dumb animal, but it also opens them to negotiation. Again, it makes more sense for the lower-powered types to be "subdued" than it would for the giant monsters of modern fiction.
If I really need to get out the big guns, there are those purple worms - everywhere under the ground ...
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Aug 14, 2015 2:04:13 GMT -6
I've always liked ubiquitous, mid-powered dragons in D&D. I see them as relatively common when young with a high mortality rate, so not many make it to great age. They are still a much bigger threat to a small community than, say, a man-eating tiger, but they can be handled by adventurers that are not quite heroes yet. Their intelligence makes them more dangerous than dumb animal, but it also opens them to negotiation. Again, it makes more sense for the lower-powered types to be "subdued" than it would for the giant monsters of modern fiction. If I really need to get out the big guns, there are those purple worms - everywhere under the ground ... And when you breakout the purple worms remember the suggestion in the back of Greyhawk and have them being used as mounts by trolls.  |
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Post by waysoftheearth on Aug 14, 2015 2:32:58 GMT -6
Don't forget to roll out 1-6 Balrogs now and then |
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