Original D&D Discussion - Gary Kurtz on the franchise

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Re: [Star Wars] Gary Kurtz on the franchise
« Reply #15 on Aug 14, 2010, 11:43pm »

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Re: [Star Wars] Gary Kurtz on the franchise
« Reply #16 on Aug 15, 2010, 3:36am »

Again, memory -- whattya gonna do?

I remember going to see another movie (not a clue which one), and there was a preview for ESB. Boy, was I stoked! And then, when it came out, there was this Episode V thing.

But first, there was this HUGE Star Wars -- I thought they were running the wrong movie, at first.

Now that my memory has been jogged, that's probably the way it happened. Wish I'd remembered that sooner.

BTW, when I first saw Star Wars (in 1977), there was an intermission. I guess they had to change the reels or something. I distinctly remember talking to my brother during the intermission.

Does anybody else remember an intermission?

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Re: [Star Wars] Gary Kurtz on the franchise
« Reply #17 on Aug 15, 2010, 7:36am »

Aug 15, 2010, 3:36am, coffee wrote:

Does anybody else remember an intermission?

For Star Wars, no, but there was an intermission when I saw ESB. I doubt it was a widespread practice back in those days and I'm pretty sure the movie wasn't made with the assumption there'd be one. As you say, I suspect it had more to do with technical issues like reel changing than anything else. The movie where I saw ESB was a small one, so they may simply have lacked the tech necessary to keep the movie rolling continuously.

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Re: [Star Wars] Gary Kurtz on the franchise
« Reply #18 on Aug 15, 2010, 11:53am »

Aug 13, 2010, 3:59pm, geoffrey wrote:

Interesting article, but I must point out two errors in it:

1. 'Lucas came up with a sprawling treatment that pulled from “Flash Gordon,” Arthurian legend, “The Hidden Fortress” and other influences. The document would have required a five-hour film but there was a middle portion that could be carved out as a stand-alone movie.'

That is simply wrong. This excellent site has all the earlier versions of the script for the 1977 Star Wars film:
http://starwarz.com/starkiller/category/star-wars-scripts/

I've read them all, and none is a sprawling, 5-hour treatment. At most you might be able to squeeze 2.5 hours out of the longest. Even then, you can trace the evolution through the successive scripts to its crystallization in the 1977 Star Wars movie. Lucas made-up ESB and ROTJ out of whole cloth much later. There aren't any chunks of the earliest scripts that made it into ESB and ROTJ. Anyone who reads these scripts will see that Star Wars was originally going to be one movie. Only financial success turned it into a multi-movie saga.

Geoffrey, that's not entirely true. Cloud City was originally the Imperial headquarters "Alderaan" and some other bits like that. The Wookiees vs. the Empire became the Ewoks vs the Empire, and so forth. Lucas really did borrow earlier ideas in later films, just not entirely. And it was, in fact, hoped that he could make more someday, though of course financial success would dictate that. The simple fact Luke and Vader never had a direct confrontation, and Vader lived, should show it was hoped there would be more.

Not to sound like a broken record, but I'd also highly recommend reading the essays on this site, which I mentioned in another thread. I think he does an excellent job explaining exactly what happened when, and why, with references.

http://secrethistoryofstarwars.com/

I really liked The Nature of the Beast article, but they are all interesting, even ones that address prequel issues. This guy did his homework.

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Re: [Star Wars] Gary Kurtz on the franchise
« Reply #19 on Aug 15, 2010, 2:07pm »

Aug 15, 2010, 3:36am, coffee wrote:

Now that my memory hasBTW, when I first saw Star Wars (in 1977), there was an intermission. I guess they had to change the reels or something. I distinctly remember talking to my brother during the intermission.

Does anybody else remember an intermission?

The very first time I saw SW, there was an intermission. I saw SW three more times after that in the summer of 1977, but there weren't intermissions in any of those showings.

I seem to remember that the intermission came right after Ben cut off that guy's arm in the cantina, but I'm not sure.

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Re: [Star Wars] Gary Kurtz on the franchise
« Reply #20 on Aug 15, 2010, 2:13pm »

Aug 15, 2010, 11:53am, blackbarn wrote:

Aug 13, 2010, 3:59pm, geoffrey wrote:

Interesting article, but I must point out two errors in it:

1. 'Lucas came up with a sprawling treatment that pulled from “Flash Gordon,” Arthurian legend, “The Hidden Fortress” and other influences. The document would have required a five-hour film but there was a middle portion that could be carved out as a stand-alone movie.'

That is simply wrong. This excellent site has all the earlier versions of the script for the 1977 Star Wars film:
http://starwarz.com/starkiller/category/star-wars-scripts/

I've read them all, and none is a sprawling, 5-hour treatment. At most you might be able to squeeze 2.5 hours out of the longest. Even then, you can trace the evolution through the successive scripts to its crystallization in the 1977 Star Wars movie. Lucas made-up ESB and ROTJ out of whole cloth much later. There aren't any chunks of the earliest scripts that made it into ESB and ROTJ. Anyone who reads these scripts will see that Star Wars was originally going to be one movie. Only financial success turned it into a multi-movie saga.

Geoffrey, that's not entirely true. Cloud City was originally the Imperial headquarters "Alderaan" and some other bits like that. The Wookiees vs. the Empire became the Ewoks vs the Empire, and so forth. Lucas really did borrow earlier ideas in later films, just not entirely. And it was, in fact, hoped that he could make more someday, though of course financial success would dictate that. The simple fact Luke and Vader never had a direct confrontation, and Vader lived, should show it was hoped there would be more.

Not to sound like a broken record, but I'd also highly recommend reading the essays on this site, which I mentioned in another thread. I think he does an excellent job explaining exactly what happened when, and why, with references.

http://secrethistoryofstarwars.com/

I really liked The Nature of the Beast article, but they are all interesting, even ones that address prequel issues. This guy did his homework.

You're right. Lucas certainly used certain names and concepts in the early scripts in later SW movies. What I'm getting at is that the idea that Lucas wrote a HUGE script that was so big he could film only a third of it in 1977, and then substantially filmed the other 2/3rds of the script later, is not the case.

I love The Secret History of Star Wars. I am proud to have influenced the author (known as "zombie" on at least two SW message boards, while my handle is "Binary Sunset"). Look at the Acknowledgements page of the book, and you'll see me specially mentioned along with six other people. 8-)

I'm also quoted later in the book. Humbled and proud.

« Last Edit: Aug 15, 2010, 2:15pm by geoffrey »

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