Falconer Level 9 Sorcerer Cleric of OD&D member is offline
OD&D, Middle-earth, Star Trek TOS
Joined: Sept 2007 Gender: Male Posts: 1,341 Location: Chicago, IL Karma: 51
Middle-earth On Crack « Thread Started on Nov 15, 2010, 1:33am »
I wanted to start a new thread about Middle-earth because I feel the other one got dominated with the question of how much you can add or change and still “be able to call it Middle-earth”. So this thread is about starting with Middle-earth and D&Ding the hell out of it, and to hell with canon. If you don’t like it, don’t post here.
I’d like to start by listing peoples’ home campaigns in which they have fleshed out or added areas to Middle-earth and subsequently published:
Stephen Poag: Mines of Khunmar as Moria. Bob Bledsaw: City-State of the Invincible Overlord (and related products) as “No-Name City” (East?) Dave Arneson: First Fantasy Campaign (Blackmoor) in the extreme North of Arnor (=The Great Kingdom) (maybe not exactly Arneson’s intent, but it could work!) Pete Fenlon: The Iron Wind in the Northeast Terry Amthor: Court of Ardor in the South
A man may do both. For not we but those who come after will make the legends of our time. The green earth, say you? That is a mighty matter of legend, though you tread it under the light of day! —J.R.R. Tolkien
Falconer Level 9 Sorcerer Cleric of OD&D member is offline
OD&D, Middle-earth, Star Trek TOS
Joined: Sept 2007 Gender: Male Posts: 1,341 Location: Chicago, IL Karma: 51
Re: Middle-earth On Crack « Reply #1 on Nov 15, 2010, 12:52pm »
So how would you place CSIO in Middle-earth? I’m thinking a Second Age, Black Numenorean capital set in a proto-Gondor/Umbar region.
A man may do both. For not we but those who come after will make the legends of our time. The green earth, say you? That is a mighty matter of legend, though you tread it under the light of day! —J.R.R. Tolkien
Finarvyn Administrator Dungeon Master member is offline
Joined: Jun 2007 Gender: Male Posts: 4,676 Location: Near Chicago Karma: 178
Re: Middle-earth On Crack « Reply #2 on Nov 15, 2010, 2:36pm »
Personally, I use the CSIO as my default "major fantasy city" so I'd probably let it represent Gondor Minas Tirith.
Marv / Finarvyn DCC playtester (2011) C&C playtester (2003) I'm partly responsible for the S&W WhiteBox Builder of the TrollBridge Master of Mutants; MA since 1976 OD&D Player since 1975
"Don't ask me what you need to hit. Just roll the die and I will let you know!" - Dave Arneson
Falconer Level 9 Sorcerer Cleric of OD&D member is offline
OD&D, Middle-earth, Star Trek TOS
Joined: Sept 2007 Gender: Male Posts: 1,341 Location: Chicago, IL Karma: 51
Re: Middle-earth On Crack « Reply #3 on Nov 15, 2010, 3:03pm »
A man may do both. For not we but those who come after will make the legends of our time. The green earth, say you? That is a mighty matter of legend, though you tread it under the light of day! —J.R.R. Tolkien
So how would you place CSIO in Middle-earth? I’m thinking a Second Age, Black Numenorean capital set in a proto-Gondor/Umbar region.
Could be. Another option might be to make it a large centre of power somewhere in the East. Maybe somehow related to the ultimate fate of the Blue Wizards?
Check out Magician's Manse, my old school Dungeons and Dragons blog.
Falconer Level 9 Sorcerer Cleric of OD&D member is offline
OD&D, Middle-earth, Star Trek TOS
Joined: Sept 2007 Gender: Male Posts: 1,341 Location: Chicago, IL Karma: 51
Re: Middle-earth On Crack « Reply #6 on Nov 15, 2010, 10:40pm »
Hell yeah, the Blue Wizards would definitely be a force. They have gone “soft corrupt”—like Saruman they are rulers of men, but with some allowance for moral ambiguity, so they are not straight-up slaves of Sauron (and in fact, at least in their own minds oppose him). I would have Alatar-Morinehtar as a LE Wizard Overlord of a City-State, and Pallando-Romestamo as CN, a dark prophet leading hordes of chariot riders.
A man may do both. For not we but those who come after will make the legends of our time. The green earth, say you? That is a mighty matter of legend, though you tread it under the light of day! —J.R.R. Tolkien
Re: Middle-earth On Crack « Reply #7 on Nov 20, 2010, 1:28pm »
I have always liked the original "Waterdeep and the North" and think it would be well placed along the coast of the sea of Rhun. I would replace Khelben Blackstaff with a good aligned Istari that I would create from scratch and make changes here and there to the personalities, creatures, and peoples that inhabit and wonder the many alleys and streets of this great city so that it would better fit Middle- Earth. Waterdeep is also a name that fits Middle-Earth very well and I would not change that. The evirons described in the accessory can also be used to the north with the appropriate changes of course. Waterdeep can also placed along the coast to the west of Gondor or to the north. Perhaps started by Numenoreans long ago...?
Re: Middle-earth On Crack « Reply #8 on Nov 21, 2010, 1:51am »
I started reading through the Mines of Khunmar and it would make an excellent stand in for Moria! Either that or MERPS Moria book. CSIO connected with the fate of the Blue Wizards in the east sounds good to me! Another JG product that I would use is the Frontier Forts of Kelnore. It would be perfect for use in the fallen kingdom of Arnor! All those ruined structures, many of them being forts and can be used for encounters or around whole adventures. The book can be used pretty much as is with only a few changes to the lists of monsters. Say, replacing the lich entry with a Nazgul that has moved into one of these forts to make mischief in the area. His mount is a Nightmare and is stabled in one of the stalls. With him perhaps are a troop of Uruk-Hai and Bugbears who raid the area. I agree with the placement of The Iron Wind to the east and north and indeed all of the original Loremaster books can easily find homes in Middle-Earth for they are obviously derived from it. I particularly like The Shade of the Sinking Plain! Again, one of the Nazgul can be the Shade and the module can easily be used as is.
Marv / Finarvyn DCC playtester (2011) C&C playtester (2003) I'm partly responsible for the S&W WhiteBox Builder of the TrollBridge Master of Mutants; MA since 1976 OD&D Player since 1975
"Don't ask me what you need to hit. Just roll the die and I will let you know!" - Dave Arneson
Joined: May 2010 Gender: Male Posts: 111 Karma: 18
Re: Middle-earth On Crack « Reply #10 on Nov 21, 2010, 7:31am »
As an alternative to Falconer's schema, how about a mid-4th Age Reign of Sauron campaign using CSIO as the capitol city sprung up around Barad Dur. The Dark Lord's victory has introduced all kinds of chaos into ME, especially Vancian magic. Most M-Us would have to train in the CSIO and return to acquire spells. This also yields a tidy rationale for ME monster ecology on crack, what with the catoblepases, otyughs, ropers, etc. continuously escaping from Sauron's bio-pits in Moria.
Adventurers seek out fame and power in the hopes of one day banding together an army of heroes and superheroes to rise up and smash the Enemy. Adventurous elves continue to slum it on Middle Earth for this reason while most of their brethren have gone off into the West.
Sauron, unsatisfied by lording it over ME, has gone all introspective in his tower, seeking out a way to whack Illuvatar. With his attention elsewhere, the scattered remnants of the old alliance begin to rebuild, clinging to hidden "points of light" (Keep on the Borderlands) in the conquered and subsequently abandoned north, where hobbits and rangers operate an insurgency. But don't get caught or you'll end up in a Slavelords module.
Former elf enclaves, sacked and pillaged in the war, are now fully qualified dungeons where awesome anti-Sauron treasures may be found (wood elf halls in Mirkwood = Quasqueton or the like). In the Misty Mountains there's trouble with giants and the subterranean Shelob-worshipers behind their raids (G, D series). Sauron's inexhaustible supply of traitors and political prisoners led to the construction of Stonehell prison. Etc.
Falconer Level 9 Sorcerer Cleric of OD&D member is offline
OD&D, Middle-earth, Star Trek TOS
Joined: Sept 2007 Gender: Male Posts: 1,341 Location: Chicago, IL Karma: 51
Re: Middle-earth On Crack « Reply #11 on Nov 21, 2010, 4:06pm »
Some great ideas, here! Yeah, I had a similar idea for an alternate timeline Fourth Age. Although just making it an alternate timeline doesn’t quite cover the rationale for all the D&Disms I would want to infuse into the world. For example, human clerics of the Valar, Shelob the Spider-god, and whatever other deities they want. But the alternate timeline helps the players know where we got “off track” and therefore be able to cash in on their knowledge of the world to drive their story forward. I would do something like this:
When the Fellowship of the Ring attempted to cross the Misty Mountains, they successfully crossed at the Pass of Caradhras and so never had to go through Moria. The point of this is to keep the Great Balrog alive in the bottom of the Mines of Moria... but note that Gandalf the Grey doesn’t die.
Gollum recovers the Ring in Cirith Ungol; Frodo is dead but Sam is possibly at large in some evil city or megadungeon somewhere, a completely badass Chaotic Good Hobbit Superhero making the bad guys pay.
At the Battle of the Black Gate, since the Ring is never destroyed, the good guys completely get their asses kicked. Gandalf the Grey, Aragorn, Legolas, Gimli, and Pippin are all killed. (Since it turns out Aragorn wasn’t the Chosen One, any Ranger PC potentially could be.) (Gandalf may or may not ever be sent back to Middle-earth as Gandalf the White.) With Gondor’s army decimated, the War of the Ring is over. But since Sauron doesn’t have the Ring, his rule does not completely cover the earth. “Points of Light” was always true for M-e, and now definitely even more so, but it’s not that simple.
The Corsairs (Black Numenoreans) take over Gondor but refuse to pay tribute to Mordor. The Age of Men has come and they don’t want to be ruled by Orcs. They just wanted to “reunite” the “Great Kingdom”, but this is obviously not the good kingdom of Elendil but rather the realm of the “real” Numenoreans, the evil empire from before the Akallabeth! Mordor is too fatigued and wary to wage open war against them at this time, so there is an uneasy stalemate. Ar-Herumor declares himself Invincible Overlord of Minas Tirth, and forces an alliance with Rohan by making Eowyn his consort, who thus becomes the Corsair Queen.
The Witch-King re-establishes his realm of Angmar in the north (duh).
The bleakness of this landscape makes it possible for Saruman to reinvent himself as a repentant good Wizard. No-one quite trusts him, but after all, he is free from the Palantir’s enslavement, and compared to everything else that’s going on, the damage he caused isn’t really remembered outside of Rohan. With Gandalf out of the picture, he establishes himself as head of the Istari once more, and his Machiavellian schemes continue.
And after the starship Intrepid crash-lands in the far north, Middle-earth will never be the same!
The world is now wide open to progress in any way the PCs want. In every corner of Middle-earth, both “on the map” and off it, here are lots of areas to adventure in, and plenty of spots to establish PC-run baronies! Plus, of course, the Ring is at large and doubtless will exchange hands...
A man may do both. For not we but those who come after will make the legends of our time. The green earth, say you? That is a mighty matter of legend, though you tread it under the light of day! —J.R.R. Tolkien
Joined: May 2010 Gender: Male Posts: 111 Karma: 18
Re: Middle-earth On Crack « Reply #12 on Nov 21, 2010, 4:51pm »
Now you're cooking with...er...crack, I guess! Since the starship has crashed this is starting to sound like the movie trilogy Peter Jackson, in his heart of hearts, should have made! "Ai! A balrog of Morgoth!" "Get a hold of yourself, Galafast...arm photon torpedoes and fire on my mark!"
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Yeah. Brain glitch there. Naturally, CSIO would make a poor nation. 
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